Vibration

My 2011 R1200R vibrates like crazy at all speeds. Its gotta be the twin jugs. Also, the front suspension is very soft. Are these normal characteristics of the R1200R? If not, what needs to be done to correct these annoying things? Not a happy camper.

Vibrations are minimal on my 07 RT (Almost inexistant)

I would start by checking the valve adjustments and do a throttle body sync.

For the front suspension, How much mileage on the bike? Do you have ESA?

My 2011 R1200R vibrates like crazy at all speeds. Its gotta be the twin jugs. Also, the front suspension is very soft. Are these normal characteristics of the R1200R? If not, what needs to be done to correct these annoying things? Not a happy camper.

Morning Roger C

"vibrates like crazy at all speeds"-- is not normal.

Some engine buzzing disturbance at certain RPMs is normal.

You need to explain the "vibrates like crazy at all speeds" before we can address that. What type of vibration? ie handlebar, mirror, foot peg, seat buzz, or a lower frequency chassis shake (like @ wheel rotating speed).

Is the vibration worse at certain engine RPM's or worse at certain road speeds? Does it get worse at higher RPM's or get worse at higher road speeds?

Is it still there if you accelerate to above the disturbance speed then de-clutch, kill the engine & coast back down through the disturbance speed?

The BMW 1200 boxer does have rather large pistons that completely stop then restart in the opposite direction twice per crankshaft revolution, plus they are offset from each other so cause a kind or twisting moment on each firing. Then add in a (single) balance shaft that can't completely remove the disturbance (can only split & move it), then solid mount the engine to the chassis so there is no isolation in the mounting. This all means the engine does have some buzzing type disturbances & that the rider can definitely feel it.

If you think that your particular BMW bike is not right then try to ride a similar BMW or have an experienced BMW twin rider ride your bike to evaluate it.

Once a rider tunes into the engine buzzing periods then they can feel it in every 2 cylinder BMW they ride-- It bother some riders to no end & other riders hardly notice it.

Vibrations are minimal on my 07 RT (Almost inexistant)

 

I would start by checking the valve adjustments and do a throttle body sync.

 

For the front suspension, How much mileage on the bike? Do you have ESA?

Bike was recently serviced by BMW so I would assume the valves and throttle body would have been set/adjusted as part of that service. Mileage clocks just under 22K. It does not have the ESA function. Is there an easy way to adjust the ring on the front shock short of removing the gas tank to access the shock?

One thing I failed to mention is I have been accustomed to riding with a custom-made corbin seat but yesterday used the stock seat (in order to dismount easier) which moved my body closer to the front of the cycle and created more pressure on the handlebars, where most of the vibration is felt.

My 2011 R1200R vibrates like crazy at all speeds. Its gotta be the twin jugs. Also, the front suspension is very soft. Are these normal characteristics of the R1200R? If not, what needs to be done to correct these annoying things? Not a happy camper.

 

Morning Roger C

 

"vibrates like crazy at all speeds"-- is not normal.

 

Some engine buzzing disturbance at certain RPMs is normal.

 

You need to explain the "vibrates like crazy at all speeds" before we can address that. What type of vibration? ie handlebar, mirror, foot peg, seat buzz, or a lower frequency chassis shake (like @ wheel rotating speed).

 

Is the vibration worse at certain engine RPM's or worse at certain road speeds? Does it get worse at higher RPM's or get worse at higher road speeds?

 

Is it still there if you accelerate to above the disturbance speed then de-clutch, kill the engine & coast back down through the disturbance speed?

 

The BMW 1200 boxer does have rather large pistons that completely stop then restart in the opposite direction twice per crankshaft revolution, plus they are offset from each other so cause a kind or twisting moment on each firing. Then add in a (single) balance shaft that can't completely remove the disturbance (can only split & move it), then solid mount the engine to the chassis so there is no isolation in the mounting. This all means the engine does have some buzzing type disturbances & that the rider can definitely feel it.

 

If you think that your particular BMW bike is not right then try to ride a similar BMW or have an experienced BMW twin rider ride your bike to evaluate it.

 

Once a rider tunes into the engine buzzing periods then they can feel it in every 2 cylinder BMW they ride-- It bother some riders to no end & other riders hardly notice it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

OK> Maybe I have overstated the vibration situation. I'll do more research and see where the most vibration is. I do know this bike vibrates much more than the R11100RT I had. Practically all the vibration was felt in the handlebars. At idle, my windshield shakes. Makes me think I'm riding a Harley. (satire)

My 2011 R1200R vibrates like crazy at all speeds. Its gotta be the twin jugs. Also, the front suspension is very soft. Are these normal characteristics of the R1200R? If not, what needs to be done to correct these annoying things? Not a happy camper.

 

Morning Roger C

 

"vibrates like crazy at all speeds"-- is not normal.

 

Some engine buzzing disturbance at certain RPMs is normal.

 

You need to explain the "vibrates like crazy at all speeds" before we can address that. What type of vibration? ie handlebar, mirror, foot peg, seat buzz, or a lower frequency chassis shake (like @ wheel rotating speed).

 

Is the vibration worse at certain engine RPM's or worse at certain road speeds? Does it get worse at higher RPM's or get worse at higher road speeds?

 

Is it still there if you accelerate to above the disturbance speed then de-clutch, kill the engine & coast back down through the disturbance speed?

 

The BMW 1200 boxer does have rather large pistons that completely stop then restart in the opposite direction twice per crankshaft revolution, plus they are offset from each other so cause a kind or twisting moment on each firing. Then add in a (single) balance shaft that can't completely remove the disturbance (can only split & move it), then solid mount the engine to the chassis so there is no isolation in the mounting. This all means the engine does have some buzzing type disturbances & that the rider can definitely feel it.

 

If you think that your particular BMW bike is not right then try to ride a similar BMW or have an experienced BMW twin rider ride your bike to evaluate it.

 

Once a rider tunes into the engine buzzing periods then they can feel it in every 2 cylinder BMW they ride-- It bother some riders to no end & other riders hardly notice it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

OK> Maybe I have overstated the vibration situation. I'll do more research and see where the most vibration is. I do know this bike vibrates much more than the R11100RT I had. Practically all the vibration was felt in the handlebars. At idle, my windshield shakes. Makes me think I'm riding a Harley. (satire)

Afternoon Roger C

Are you feeling a vibration or more like a mirror blurring buzz?

If a higher frequency, hand numbing mirror blurring buzz then in some cases adding more bar end weight can calm that to be better & less irritating. (there is a reason that BMW added that weight to the end of the bars)

If you think it is worse since your service then take the bike back to the dealer that did that HIGH DOLLAR service, least they can do for the money that you paid them is to put your mind at ease about your vibration concerns.

Just so you understand-- ALL 2 cylinder BMW boxer engines have buzz periods, the 1100 & 1150 had smaller engines so just allowed the peak disturbance to fall where it will. When the 1200 boxer engine became larger & had higher compression then BMW needed to address the peak buzz periods as they were pretty harsh, so they added a balance shaft to split the peak buzz periods & lower the peaks, but a single balance shaft on an inherently balanced boxer engine can NOT remove the buzz, it can only lower the peaks & spread the disturbance over a wider range.

Think about it-- the BMW boxer engine is an inherently balanced engine (crankshaft is dynamically balanced, pistons go in & out opposed so they should be counter balancing, flywheel is balanced, etc. On paper the engine shouldn't need a balance shaft, as, what balance issue are they trying to hide with a balance shaft on an inherently balanced engine?

The pistons not being directly opposed is one the shortcomings that need to be balanced out. Due to the connecting rods being on individual crankshaft throws that means the pistons can not be directly across from each other (the larger the cylinder bores, the farther apart the cylinders need to be offset)\. This offset of the mass of the pistons & the harshness of the higher compression 1200 engine cause a very sharp engine rock (called a rocking couple) at each cylinder firing. This rocking couple as well as some off-order firing disturbances all add up to become a mid to higher RPM buzz issue.

The good news is that most BMW boxer riders get used to the buzz periods & either ignore, it or adjust to it, or like me, try to appease it a little with added bar end weigh, adding some flex to the handlebar mounting, etc.

It is difficult to advise you as we don't know if you have a problem with chassis vibration, or a higher frequency engine driven buzz, or even if the vibration/buzz that you are feeling is a normal boxer buzz or an abnormal problem that needs to be looked into.

At idle, my windshield shakes. Makes me think I'm riding a Harley. (satire)

Sidenote: My 2018 Harley-Davidson FLHTP (with the new Milwaukee 8 engine) vibrates reasonably close the the amount that my 1999 R1100RT does at idle. At cruise speed on the highway speed of around 75 mph, the HD is much smoother than either my R1100RT or my 2008 R1200RT. .

YMMV.... but not by much.

after the tuning is right......Grip puppies and bar end weights will help a lot.

I could be completely off here, but the R1200R has a dampener rod / shaft on the front fork?

Could the abnormal vibrations be related to that?

dirtrider, are there different weighted bar ends which can be used? If so, how can I tell what the existing bar ends weigh?

Also, I was asked if my throttles were electronically controlled or manually controlled with cables?

dirtrider, are there different weighted bar ends which can be used? If so, how can I tell what the existing bar ends weigh?

 

Also, I was asked if my throttles were electronically controlled or manually controlled with cables?

Morning Roger C

Yes & no, BMW only offers one bar end weight for the 1200R bike (the ones that came on it) but there are heavier aftermarket weights available as well as the heavier BMW 800 weights that might fit.

At one time I did weigh the BMW stock end weights but not sure if I kept the info (otherwise just remove a weight & weigh it on a kitchen scale)

On your throttles being electronically controlled or manually controlled with cables? -- Both, the idle throttle control is electronic using stepper motors & anything above idle is controlled with cables from the twist grip.

after the tuning is right......Grip puppies and bar end weights will help a lot.

The tuning is right.

Done with a home-made manometer and balanced within mm's from off idle to 4500 RPM on both BMW bikes. Both bikes pull up evenly through the RPM range so cables are pulling equally and off the stops at the same time. Both BMW's have bar end weights. I've been doing this since 1999. The new HD engine is just that good. The new counter-balancer takes almost all the vibration out of it at idle. Once it comes off idle, it's smooth as silk.

after the tuning is right......Grip puppies and bar end weights will help a lot.

 

The tuning is right.

 

Done with a home-made manometer and balanced within mm's from off idle to 4500 RPM on both BMW bikes. Both bikes pull up evenly through the RPM range so cables are pulling equally and off the stops at the same time. Both BMW's have bar end weights. I've been doing this since 1999. The new HD engine is just that good. The new counter-balancer takes almost all the vibration out of it at idle. Once it comes off idle, it's smooth as silk.

Well, that's better than the WetHead, as it puts my feet to sleep and buzzes badly in the grips. Much worse then the old HexHead.

after the tuning is right......Grip puppies and bar end weights will help a lot.

 

The tuning is right.

 

Done with a home-made manometer and balanced within mm's from off idle to 4500 RPM on both BMW bikes. Both bikes pull up evenly through the RPM range so cables are pulling equally and off the stops at the same time. Both BMW's have bar end weights. I've been doing this since 1999. The new HD engine is just that good. The new counter-balancer takes almost all the vibration out of it at idle. Once it comes off idle, it's smooth as silk.

 

Well, that's better than the WetHead, as it puts my feet to sleep and buzzes badly in the grips. Much worse then the old HexHead.

Afternoon Bernie

The new wethead is about the same as the BMW 1200RT as it is a 2 cylinder boxer engine of about the same size. Some are worse than others but the they ALL (all BMW 2 cylinder boxers have buzz periods). It's just a fact of engine physics.

If you want a smoother 2 cylinder boxer engine then you will need a different configuration than a 2 cylinder boxer. 4 cylinder boxer is better as the pistons are smaller & the offsets are better with better cross side firing impulses.

If you want a real smooth boxer then you will need a 6 cylinder boxer as those don't run both sides opposed so when 2 pistons are stopped at the each end of stroke 4 other pistons are still moving. With proper balance a 6 cylinder boxer can be very/very smooth.

Thanks DR. I stick with the WetHead for now. As long as the electrical gremlins don't get me.

It is mainly in a certain rpm range and I can just up or down shift to get out of it.

I know that having a 2 cylinder of any configuration will have vibrations. It's the nature of the beast.

I replaced the stock bar end weights on my R1200R with home made stainless steel weights. I just weighed the stock weights that I took off. They weigh 259 grams each. The weights I made are 1.5" diameter X 2 3/8" long made from stainless steel bar stock. They weigh 513 grams each. I have the added weights and grip puppies and I am a happy camper. I noticed a difference when I added the larger weights. How much better I can not say. After all a new broom sweeps clean.

Just my 2 cents

Roger L

Well, that's better than the WetHead, as it puts my feet to sleep and buzzes badly in the grips. Much worse then the old HexHead.

Very odd.

Mine is a lot better then the Hexhead or Oilhead were. And it's one of the first Wetheads (2014 model).

I have reviewed all the changes I made to the R1200R i recently purchased to include risers, heavy weight bar ends, radar detector and a radio. I did not measure end to end to reset the handlebars. If not exactly centered, would this cause handlebar vibration? The bar end weights certainly helped reduce-almost eliminate-vibration at highway speeds. However, at idle up to about 30 mph I can feel vibration in my hands. I checked the engine guards and they are smooth as silk, so the vibration is handlebar related.

In reading the Haynes repair manual, a statement which makes me wonder is the idle speed cannot be synced with a vacuum gauge. What's the work-around to verify equal vacuum at idle, since the idle function is electronically controlled by stepper motors? Can the motors be tested? can they be disconnected to permit syncing the TB at idle speed? A buddy is bringing his vacuum gauge over on Thursday for a TB sync. I'm about to pull the trigger on buying one myself. They are readily available on fleabay for $85. Capital Cycle went to the trouble to list every cycle separately the Twinmax is applicable when the unit itself is the same. So, one does not have to buy the one liisted for BMW, just pick one and you are good to go.

Morning Roger C

I have reviewed all the changes I made to the R1200R i recently purchased to include risers, heavy weight bar ends, radar detector and a radio. I did not measure end to end to reset the handlebars. If not exactly centered, would this cause handlebar vibration? --It could s-l-i-g-h-t-l-y effect resident frequency of each side of the handlebars but probably not enough to cause your problem. Off-center handlebars (personally) bothers me to no end but I haven't ever noticed it to effect the vibration more a visual & straight line feel thing.

The bar end weights certainly helped reduce-almost eliminate-vibration at highway speeds. However, at idle up to about 30 mph I can feel vibration in my hands. I checked the engine guards and they are smooth as silk, so the vibration is handlebar related. -- Is this ONLY when moving or can you feel it the same while sitting still & revving the engine to the same RPM's as your idle to 30 mph operating RPM's?

In reading the Haynes repair manual, a statement which makes me wonder is the idle speed cannot be synced with a vacuum gauge.--True, there is NO WAY to manually change the idle RPM or the idle cross side balance. It is computer controlled by the fueling computer through stepper motors. If you try to change the idle balance using the base idle stop screws you will mess up the TB operation & it is almost impossible to ever get the TB's back to factory settings. NEVER/EVER/////NEVER attempt to adjust the Throttle Body base idle screws on a stepper controlled BMW boxer.

What's the work-around to verify equal vacuum at idle, since the idle function is electronically controlled by stepper motors? -- There is no workaround as it is what it is. Now there IS a specification for warm engine cross side vacuum at idle (max 25 mbar) & if it shows more that that then you have other problems (like burnt or mis-adjusted valves, or vacuum leaks, or someone messed with the idle screws, or a tight throttle cable, or a broken TB cable pulley cam, or something wrong with the engine or engine control.

Can the motors be tested? --Yes, definitely but not easily unless you have a GS-911 or you really know what you are doing. DO NOT EVER remove a stepper motor then turn the key on to test it or you will hate yourself all day & probably the next day as the pintle will quickly screw itself out & it is VERY/VERY//VERY///VERY!!!!! difficult to reinstall that pintle again (it can be done but almost impossible to figure out on your own & very difficult to explain over the internet due to the complexity of doing it (just don't do that!)

If you have good ears (or a mechanics stethoscope) you can probably hear each stepper run it's pintle to seat the return to starting counts when key is first turned on-- this can tell you that they are working but not if working correctly.

You can also look for proper engine fast idle after cold start & if OK & cross side cold idle TB balance is ok then steppers are probably at least working.

Can they be disconnected to permit syncing the TB at idle speed?--Yes & no, they can be disconnected but ONLY if disconnected at the proper pintle stepper count. MUCH better to just leave them operational OR use a GS-911 to properly park them. BUT AGAIN, there is NO WAY to sync at idle (you can check it but should NEVER attempt to adjust it as there is no means to adjust without screwing the TB system up royally (just don't do that)-- CHECK= OK // ADJUST = NEVER!!!!!!!

A buddy is bringing his vacuum gauge over on Thursday for a TB sync.-- This could be good or could be bad. If a standard vacuum gauge or gauges (inches of mercury) then it will cause WAY more problems than it will ever solve. If a high end gauge, or a twin input gauge that reads in inches of H2o then it's usable. Best thing to use is a simple homemade U tube manometer that uses H2o or transmission fluid in the U tube. Remember that on the BMW 1200 boxer that you are not measuring the vacuum against atmosphere you are measuring & comparing to the other side cylinder's vacuum (cross side balance). This is REALLY well suited to using a homemade U tube manometer as those are SUPER accurate as a cross side comparison tool.

I'm about to pull the trigger on buying one myself. They are readily available on fleabay for $85. Capital Cycle went to the trouble to list every cycle separately the Twinmax is applicable when the unit itself is the same. --The twin max will work but in my opinion not as good as a homemade U tube manometer filled with water. If you use a TwinMax then make darn sure that you use it correctly, verify calibration, & reverse the hoses side to side to verify that it reads the exact same (or use a single vacuum tee on one side into both Twin Max hoses to positively verify that it reads the exact same on both sides off of one vacuum source). Personally I prefer (& better trust) a homemade liquid U tube manometer as they never need calibration, never lie, are VERY responsive, & are about the most accurate way to verify cross side TB balance. (only down side is IF the TB system is way out of whack the engine can suck the fluid out of the U tube so a U tube manometer is best used on a somewhat close TB system).

So, one does not have to buy the one listed for BMW, just pick one and you are good to go. -- See the above, you don't even need one but if you buy one make sure it will work on a BMW 2 cylinder boxer.

Measuring from end of handlebars to bridge, one side is .25" longer than the other. Hardly not worth the effort to loosen and move .125" to exactly center handlebars in middle of of bridge. The heavier bar end weights certainly help reduce the vibration. Seems I have a BMW which has more vibration (buzz as you call it) than others. up to 3,000 rpm while engine is under load, there is vibration. past 3,000-3,500 rpm, the vibration smooths out. Problem is at 3,000 rpms I'm going 60 mph on flat ground and 60 is the posted speed limit. So, I'll have to learn to ride with the vibration or sell the bike to someone that is not bothered by the vibration of a boxer engine. I can also install another pair of grip puppies to help absorb the vibration and sacrifice some of the warmth of heated grips.

I failed to mention in the above post, using a Twin Max vacuum gauge, there was no variation from one cylinder to the other at 2,000 rpms, 2500 rpms and 3,000 rpms.

rpm..

No variation at all??? While keeping track of its original position, does the Twin Max show a variation if you adjust the sync?

No variation at all??? While keeping track of its original position, does the Twin Max show a variation if you adjust the sync?

Afternoon Selden

No need to mess with the sync, while holding the twist grip steady just reach down & move one side TB cam a degree or so, that will change the cross side balance & that change should show on the TwinMax.

Good point — as usual, you have cut to the heart of the matter, which is why you are such a valuable resource to this forum.

Still waiting to hear back from Roger C

Good point — as usual, you have cut to the heart of the matter, which is why you are such a valuable resource to this forum.

 

Still waiting to hear back from Roger C

Since the throttle bodies were balanced, when reading the TwinMax dial, the reading stayed at "0" so no adjustment was made to either side. But if I understand what dirtrider said, if one side TB was changed, the other side would change the same amount due to the throttle bodies being tied together with the cross side cable.

Good point — as usual, you have cut to the heart of the matter, which is why you are such a valuable resource to this forum.

 

Still waiting to hear back from Roger C

 

Since the throttle bodies were balanced, when reading the TwinMax dial, the reading stayed at "0" so no adjustment was made to either side. But if I understand what dirtrider said, if one side TB was changed, the other side would change the same amount due to the throttle bodies being tied together with the cross side cable.

Morning Roger C

Sort of but not exactly-- only the side that you move would change the most (the side that you manually move should change more then the non-moved side). That is the basic idea of moving one side by hand as it verifies that the TwinMax is working correctly by showing a dissimilar reading. Now on a U tube manometer both sides would move opposed as one side is reading against the other side.

What Selden was getting at is very/very/VERY seldom does the cross side vacuum (balance) reading remain EXACTLY the same as you move the throttle through a few RPM ranges. If it stays the EXACT same then that puts up a bit of a red flag about the vacuum gauge working properly.

That is the reason that I personally like a simple U tube liquid manometer, unless a hose is plugged, they never lie.