96 R1100RT Electrical Issue

Hello everyone, new to this forum, just bought a well used (112,000 mi) R 1100RT about 2 months ago and I'm having a blast on it. Well at least till the horn went out the other day.

I found the black side(neg) of the horn wasn't getting a proper connection and proceeded to repair it. Got it working and then the windshield motor and the turn signals wouldn't work.

I also noticed since I've had the bike that the accessory plug on the dash didn't have power to it, so I thought that while I had the left side tupperware off and the dash plastic off I found

the supply power plug to the accessory plug was disconnected.... I checked the plug with a meter and found (eureka) dc power so I plugged it in...

Ok, so at this point I verified the horn still worked and there was still power to the accessory plug so I put back all the tupperware and dash....Well guess what, after all of that

I tried the horn and accessory plug and neither one is working now!

Ok so I went to the fuse box and checked every single fuse with the multimeter for continuity and confirmed none of the fuses had blown....Actually did this procedure TWICE

as I was hoping it was something simple like a 2 cent fuse, but all the fuses test fine...

So now here's the situation: here's the stuff that still works!

- bike fires up and runs with no problem

- headlight low and high beam are

- brake- Tail-License plate lights are all good and bright-no dimming at all

Here's the stuff that now doesn't work after trying to get the horn to work

-windsheild up or down is now inoperative

-All turn signals front and back inoperative

-Horn is inoperative

Here's a bit more background on the bike....The battery is in very good shape, even after not running for a week or two is showing 12.85V

I never had an issue with the windshield or turn signals till I tried to fix the horn...Could I have shorted something out by trying to fix the horn?

Is there more than one fuse panel on these bikes?? other than the one under the riders seat?

Can a relay in that fuse panel be giving me this issue? and if so, how does one check these relays easily?

I've spent 3 days now scratching my head re: this issue and need help bad...I have some knowledge of 12 volt and own a top quality meter and feel the answer is just under my nose!

BUT you know the saying a little knowledge can get you in a HEAP of TROUBLE....

Would appreciate any and all input....I"m amazed with how good this bike runs and handles after this kind of mileage and looking forward to get back out there!

Morning boxerguy

First thing to check is with key on see if you have 12v power going INTO then OUT-OF fuse #3 & into & out-of fuse #4 (this should give us a direction to look farther)

I'm assuming the load relief relay is powering up & working as you seem to have operational headlight.

You mention black at the horn??? There is no black at the horn, low side (ground) is brown & power side is green/gray. Are you sure on the wire color?

You might also have a common low (ground) problem so verify that the brown wires at all the effected items have good continuity (low resistance) to the battery (-) post.

Good Morning dirtrider

First off, I want to thank you for your quick reply to my posting...

The previous owner had the bike for only 9 months, and did not do ANY maintenance on his own...He should me invoices he had paid to a Beemer dealer

for the rear Monoshock replacement, TBS, valve adjustment, and oil and air filter changes...He also told me the horn was replaced because he wanted

a louder one. It's mounted on a V-type flat galvanized bracket that looks like it could take two horns...

I found a RED wire attached to one post and a Black wire on the other post...The Red wire had two leads coming out, one went to the horn and the other

was just hanging around doing nothing...snipped off not exposing any bare wire! I'm assuming there might have been two horns at one time.

The black wire was fastened to a bolt where the horn bracket attached to the frame under the ignition housing.

When I encountered the Horn problem, I found a very poor connection to ground at that bracket, so I went on a hunt for a better place to connect the horn ground.

I found a lone (brown) wire coming out of the wiring harness near the left fork, put a meter on it and found 12v power so I attached the horn neg to it and got a

good, solid functioning horn. I then plugged in the accessory plug I found was disconnected, after confirming the plug was indeed 12v live and then buttoned

everything up...That's when I found the problem with the the windshield and turn signals...

OK, now I went and did the Test you suggested....FIRST, WITH THE KEY OFF - I checked Fuse 3 IN AND Out...reads 12.8 volts...with the KEY ON reads 11.6volts

THEN WITH KEY OFF FUSE #4 SHOWS NO POWER...WITH KEY ON...SHOWS 12V...

SO, should Fuse #3 with the key OFF not show any voltage?? If that is the case, then there must be a problem!

Thanks for all your help..

Good Morning dirtrider

 

First off, I want to thank you for your quick reply to my posting...

 

The previous owner had the bike for only 9 months, and did not do ANY maintenance on his own...He should me invoices he had paid to a Beemer dealer

for the rear Monoshock replacement, TBS, valve adjustment, and oil and air filter changes...He also told me the horn was replaced because he wanted

a louder one. It's mounted on a V-type flat galvanized bracket that looks like it could take two horns...

 

I found a RED wire attached to one post and a Black wire on the other post...The Red wire had two leads coming out, one went to the horn and the other

was just hanging around doing nothing...snipped off not exposing any bare wire! I'm assuming there might have been two horns at one time.

The black wire was fastened to a bolt where the horn bracket attached to the frame under the ignition housing.

When I encountered the Horn problem, I found a very poor connection to ground at that bracket, so I went on a hunt for a better place to connect the horn ground.

 

I found a lone (brown) wire coming out of the wiring harness near the left fork, put a meter on it and found 12v power so I attached the horn neg to it and got a

good, solid functioning horn. I then plugged in the accessory plug I found was disconnected, after confirming the plug was indeed 12v live and then buttoned

everything up...That's when I found the problem with the the windshield and turn signals...

 

OK, now I went and did the Test you suggested....FIRST, WITH THE KEY OFF - I checked Fuse 3 IN AND Out...reads 12.8 volts...with the KEY ON reads 11.6volts

THEN WITH KEY OFF FUSE #4 SHOWS NO POWER...WITH KEY ON...SHOWS 12V...

 

SO, should Fuse #3 with the key OFF not show any voltage?? If that is the case, then there must be a problem!

Thanks for all your help..

Afternoon boxerguy

First off-- I don't understand your brown wire having 12 volts but then using it as a ground? Was one of your meter leads on the battery (+) post?

On the fuse power tests-- Fuse #3 is full time 12v so should always have power to & through it no matter key position (seems you are OK on this)

Fuse #3 should not have 12v with key OFF, should have 12v with key on, should not have 12v during engine cranking (due to load relief relay function).

It seems that you have 12v where you need it so that side seems OK.

The chances of ALL the functions that went dead at the same all going out at once are pretty slim due to individual power supply issues (seeing as your fuse power is good) so at first glance it looks like problem isn't on the 12v side of things. (we might have to prove this yes/no at a later time though)

So at the moment & with the little info we have (internet communication is a poor way to track electrical issues but we usually eventually win them all).

It is sort of pointing to a common ground problem (brown wires connect together then go on as a common grounding)

So next check is to unplug the individual connectors at each failed accessory then back probe with an ohmmeter between the battery (-) post & brown wire on that connector. You need to measure good continuity to the battery (-) post (very low resistance).

Based on the info that we have at the moment I'm thinking that you will find an open ground path. If you find a broken ground path then finding the point that contains the failure will be more difficult as most solder joints are hidden within the main wire harness. (we'll address this if you find an open in the ground path)

It's very possible that when you grounded the horn to that hanging brown wire then tooted the horn, if the horn is a high current horn, then it might have overloaded the ground path & failed that ground path wire or a ground path connection (somewhat of a possibility anyhow)

Added: as a quick check make sure that if your battery (-) post has any brown wires going to it that none are broken & that they are making proper connection.

Firstly, my positive(red) meter lead was connected to the battery (+) positive post when I checked the lone brown wire for power...

Also after connecting the horn and verifying operation...I must have tried it at least 6 or 7 more times to confirm stability of the connection

before deciding to close up the tupperware and dash. It wasn't like the horn only worked once and then everything died...One would think

if my horn connection was the culprit, it would have fried something on the first honk...just a thought...

Anyhow I will attempt the resistance tests that you advised just now this afternoon and will get back online to this forum this evening

with my findings...I'll write down the resistance values I find, and relay those figures in the next reply...

Again thanks for all the advice!

Just throwing this out there.

If this is a R1100RT-P, a retired Police bike, that should be noted as well with any wiring headache.

No it's not the Police version....I confirmed a good connection this afternoon to the front turn signals. OHM reading on the neg of each read 1.4 ohms.

Couldn't get the Nose cone Tupperware off to get at the windshield motor...Is there a trick to getting it off? Removed all visible small Torx 15 screws, then

there are (2) Two large Phillips #3 screws on each side near the wirrors.

Does the cone come off at this point? or is there something else that I'm missing?

No it's not the Police version....I confirmed a good connection this afternoon to the front turn signals. OHM reading on the neg of each read 1.4 ohms.

 

Couldn't get the Nose cone Tupperware off to get at the windshield motor...Is there a trick to getting it off? Removed all visible small Torx 15 screws, then

there are (2) Two large Phillips #3 screws on each side near the wirrors.

 

Does the cone come off at this point? or is there something else that I'm missing?

Evening boxerguy

1.4 ohms could be enough resistance to cause a problem (especially at a no current loading).

So, next lets verify what you have under load--

Plug the horn back in then put your voltmeter on the 20v DC scale, now put the red meter lead on the brown wire at the horn & black meter lead on the battery (-) post. Now turn the key on & press the horn button (if you see much voltage like over 1.5 volts) on your meter then you have a ground path issue.

If no voltage shown, or very little then move the meter red lead to the B+ terminal on the horn & push the horn button again (you definitely want to see 11+ dc voltage here).

Post back what you find.

Don't worry about the windshield motor test for now as we can use the easier connectors to find your issue.

Good evening dirtrider

I wouldn't have thought that 1.4 ohms was a lot of resistance! I also tried it on the continuity function and got a nice loud instant beep so I thought

that I must of had a good connection at the turn signals....That shows you how little knowledge I have of this stuff...

I will run those tests that you describe in the morning daylight tomorrow and record what I find and as you said I'll

Post back the results...

Have a good evening!

Good evening dirtrider

 

I wouldn't have thought that 1.4 ohms was a lot of resistance! I also tried it on the continuity function and got a nice loud instant beep so I thought

that I must of had a good connection at the turn signals....That shows you how little knowledge I have of this stuff...

 

I will run those tests that you describe in the morning daylight tomorrow and record what I find and as you said I'll

Post back the results...

 

Have a good evening!

Boxerguy,

Just FYI, when you are looking for continuity you want to see as close to 0 ohms as possible. 1.4 ohms is high, IMO, for this kind of check even though it seems low. You can have a good wire, but if you have some oxidation or corrosion at the connection end (say at the battery terminal) you'll see higher resistance. Also, the current load a meter puts on the circuit is very low. When a higher load is put on it the poor connection causes a higher voltage drop because it can't carry the current.

Tom

Sorry to poke my nose in here. Boxerguy. You say you have 1.4 ohm resistance. What does your DVM (Ohm meter) measure when you just hold the probes together. And is the battery in the DVM in good condition. I don't want st start a red herring here, but if your test equipment starts leading you up a dead end, that is not good either.

Morning__

Lets not get off course here chasing meter accuracy or resistance possibilities.

His next tests (actual loaded circuit voltage-drop on the ground circuit) should eliminate ohmmeter inaccuracies or possible open ground circuits under working load.

That 1.4 ohms could still be pointing to a fully open ground circuit with that 1.4 ohm reading coming from some other item or items using that same ground circuit. It was just a suggested quick test to see if we should look farther in that direction.

Tom

Thanks for the explanation...The battery terminal was completely clean of debris or corrosion, but the wiring connectors at the front turn signals were somewhat

dirty and older looking...I would say consistent with the bike being 22 years old. I'm going to give them a good cleaning with a soft wire brush this morning

when I go back out there to do the testing that D.R. suggested yesterday.

I did find evidence of either vaseline or dielectric grease in the connector when I pulled it off.

Also, seeing we are on this topic of testing, Is it better to be using alligator clips on the multimeter? For the battery side, an alligator clip facilitates that branch

staying put while I'm in another location on the bike probing, say the turn signal...but should I be using an alligator clip also on the device being checked?

or is a standard probe lead sufficient?

Walter

Actually, AndyS might have a point here also, I'm using a Fluke Multimeter that I bought 3 years ago and haven't changed the battery in it since..

I have a new 9 volt battery that I can install in it before going out to do the other tests this morning

Walter

Actually, AndyS might have a point here also, I'm using a Fluke Multimeter that I bought 3 years ago and haven't changed the battery in it since..

I have a new 9 volt battery that I can install in it before going out to do the other tests this morning

 

Walter

Afternoon Walter

You mentioned above that you measured 12 volts between the brown wire & the battery (+) post so your meter seems to be able to read 12 volts OK.

Good Evening to ALL who have contributed their thoughts on my Electrical Issues....Especially D.R. for your thoughtful Troubleshooting...

IT was a gorgeous day here in SW Arizona, so I decided to get right to it and once and for all get to the bottom of the issues!

I cleaned all the terminal connectors at the front turn signals and got the resistance down to .2 to .4 ohms...but that didn't get them working again.

Now, remember when D.R. asked me to confirm 12v power at Fuse #3 in and out a couple of days ago...I had checked all the fuses the very first

day I noticed an issue and didn't find a blown fuse either by looking at them with a good flashlight and doing a continuity test on them with my meter....

I also re-checked every fuse a second time 2 days ago, with the same method....well....for some reason I said it can't hurt to check them a 3rd time

and wouldn't you know it, I found a blown fuse in slot #3...Anyhow I changed it this afternoon and all the affected devices worked perfectly again...

Including the horn...Now, I do believe initially that I must have lost a good ground connection to the horn and that's why it quit...

The flimsy metal galvanized tabs that the horn was mounted on is not a great place to get a good solid connection...IMO

I also went to my local NAPA store and got a Nifty FIAMMA Freeway Blaster (138 DB) and mounted it in Tandem with the original Horn. I then drilled

a very small 5/32 hole in a convenient place on a frame rail where I scrapped away some of the paint and ran ground wires from both horns to that point

and solidly fastened them down with a small self tapping screw!

After all that, with the press of the horn button I got the sweet sound of Two Horns in Unison and the next time a 4-wheeler cuts me off they better be

prepared to clean out their shorts!

I tested the 2 horn setup at least another 5 or 6 times with no issues...The turn signals, windshield motor all worked fine as well.

I'm still perplexed though as to why Fuse #3 was not blown the first few days troubleshooting the issues! I know for a fact it was OK then but not today...

Very strange, in any event all is good now and thanks to all for your expertise and input to my problem...

I've learned lots from all of this and will file this in the memory drawer for future consideration, should the need arise again...

 

I'm still perplexed though as to why Fuse #3 was not blown the first few days troubleshooting the issues! I know for a fact it was OK then but not today...

Very strange, in any event all is good now and thanks to all for your expertise and input to my problem...

I've learned lots from all of this and will file this in the memory drawer for future consideration, should the need arise again...

Afternoon Walter

Sometimes things just slip through the cracks & need to be found on a 2nd or 3rd look.

Difficult to say on your fuse failure after checking.

My gut feeling & educated guess is that it was failed the entire time, just didn't show up during testing.

I have seen more than one electrical accessory, fuse, relay, etc show good at first glance when using an ohmmeter to test. If the ohmmeter is placed on a very high resistance setting for the continuity testing (like 200K or 2000K), then if the ohmmeter probes are held on the contact points for the test with a persons fingers, the moisture in the skin & basic conductivity of a human body can give a meter reading. You won't see a 0 ohm reading but the meter numbers move & scroll so a person thinks, hey, it must be good as the meter showed continuity. All the time not realizing that they were just measuring their own body conductivity. (learned-- always test for fuse, switch, wire continuity on the lowest ohm scale).

If you tested using an ohmmeter with the fuse in place (still in the fuse box) then it is possible that you didn't actually measure continuity across the fuse but measured the circuit resistance from a common point at the ignition switch on the 12v supply side to a common low (ground) on another circuit (ie back through horn windings or back through relay pull in coils). If testing a fuse with it still in the fuse box then it should be tested powered up & tested with voltmeter or test light.

In the many years that I have been testing & dealing with automotive & motorcycle fuse testing I have seen a number of fuses that didn't work but were not completely blown (no big gap in the fueable link inside the fuse). Some had a very fine hairline open & others had an internal connection issue but looked just fine. I have even seen a couple that tested OK with an ohmmeter but would go open as soon as a load was placed on them.

The one thing I am pretty sure of is that in the future you will probably more thoroughly test your suspected fuses (or just replace them with a known good one).

Good Evening D.R

I would tend to agree with you about the fact, that the fuse was blown all the time but didn't indicate ir either visually or with the meter. I may have been

sloppy when holding the probes to the fuse...as you indicate, there may have been moisture on my fingers as well...

I actually did remove the fuses to test them and visually look at them.

As you say, it might be prudent when or if the next time arises, to just change the suspect fuse with a known good one!