Cornering ABS

I have a friend, newly back into riding after a 30+ hiatus, currently doing well riding a Bonneville Black. He's thinking about touring-capable bikes, and as a techie, he's kind of obsessed with only getting a bike with cornering ABS. So far, it's available on a fairly short list of bikes, all high-end models. It looks like BMW only made it available as the "ABS Pro" option on the R1200RT in 2017.

Does anybody here have any experience with either corning ABS saving you from a crash, or with having a crash that you believe you could have avoided had you had cornering ABS? I've never had it and have never felt the need of it.

I am a big time techie, but I am with you on this one. I had rented a fully loaded '17 RT in New Zealand, last November, for 10 days, and I have to say that my deeply ingrained riding instincts will not allow me to even try that feature out! As for preventing accidents, I can't see that, because if you know how to ride properly, you wouldn't be in the position in the first place! What the cornering ABS allow is that one can break those rules, safely, and push the envelope further for better cornering speed performance.

Most of the motorcycle-specific systems are limited to one marque and make of tire. If it's a tire you don't care for, you can either change the tire and accept that the system might not work as well as it could, or stick with the OEM rubber. It also won't help with anything other than throttle and brake inputs while cornering, something that lots of folks seem to have a problem understanding.

I have had a crash that the system might have saved me from. Back in '10, I was riding at BIR and had a low-side in a corner due to a combination of cooked tires and too much front brake input. An ABS system with an IMU might have saved me (and my collar bone), or not.

I have a friend, newly back into riding after a 30+ hiatus, currently doing well riding a Bonneville Black. He's thinking about touring-capable bikes, and as a techie, he's kind of obsessed with only getting a bike with cornering ABS. So far, it's available on a fairly short list of bikes, all high-end models. It looks like BMW only made it available as the "ABS Pro" option on the R1200RT in 2017.

 

Does anybody here have any experience with either corning ABS saving you from a crash, or with having a crash that you believe you could have avoided had you had cornering ABS? I've never had it and have never felt the need of it.

Morning Bill

Sounds like a co-worker of mine-- he must have an ABS system on his off-road bike, we all turn ours's off when off road but he claims that he NEEDS it. He is always the last one at the next rest stop, can barely get his bike down a steep loose surface hill, even though he is slow he regularly overshoots a loose surface corner (he couldn't pick a good line if it was painted on the road surface). He doesn't need an upgraded ABS he needs off-road riding lessons.

Seems like it would be a complicated system with a lot of disclaimers. It might be a good thing for a poor-skills rider, or if correctly tuned for the specific track, possibly a track bike system.

Long standing rule is you just don't brake hard on a single track vehicle when leaned over.

If he really wants a bike with cornering ABS then he should get it as he won't be happy with a standard ABS system. Personally, I would rather put that money into advanced riding instruction & learn to ride correctly then I wouldn't need an electronic nanny to protect me from my bad riding habits.

I can conceive of an emergency-braking circumstance of riding 2-lane tight twisties through wooded mountains and being surprised while heeled over in a curve by a deer suddenly jumping in your lane. "Cornering ABS" might possibly make a difference, depending on speed and all other factors being equal, but such a feature definitely wouldn't make or break a bike deal to me.

(As a side note, I experienced an event on a curve where a deer leaped from a high right embankment OVER my bike and landed on the opposite lane, its hooves just missing my passenger's head.)

Yamaha Niken…...I'll let you google it....

I have a 2016 RT, and an 09 before that. I am always amazed how quick I can bleed off speed in corners with little effort. Its actually a confidence builder. I haven't had a serious emergency situation, but I do believe that if I did I would be able handle it. I can't imagine grabbing a hand full of brake lever in a corner.

It's a feature you hope not to have to use, but if you EVER round the bend faster than you can stop while leaned over it may save your bacon! Now if you changed your riding habits because of it, for example to become less cautious in those blind corners, then it's value as a 'safety feature' suddenly wanes 'o)

I am a big time techie, but I am with you on this one. I had rented a fully loaded '17 RT in New Zealand, last November, for 10 days, and I have to say that my deeply ingrained riding instincts will not allow me to even try that feature out! As for preventing accidents, I can't see that, because if you know how to ride properly, you wouldn't be in the position in the first place! What the cornering ABS allow is that one can break those rules, safely, and push the envelope further for better cornering speed performance.

All your "deeply ingrained riding instincts" will go right out the window the moment some soccer mom turns left on front of you or you come around a blind corner and a fallen rock or tree limb is in your lane.

Way back in late '98-'99 when the California Highway Patrol began receiving the first of the BMW R1100RTP's, the riders raise all kinds of ruckus over the ABS, footpegs, clutch, because they were used to the KZ1000P.

Many of the senior officers kept their KZ's to the very end until they were directed to take the BMW getting dusty in the motor pool shed so the KZ could go back to Sac to auction.

The CHP Academy has a reputation for being the toughest in the country. Some departments send their officers there because it is the toughest and the riders that come out are some of the best in the U.S.

Prior to the RT, even with the antiquated early ABS of the 1100, the accounting office had to "factor in " losing 3 officers a year due to motorcycle traffic accidents.

Obviously, the training had to be modified to suit ABS, instead of "laying it down" etc, the officers were tought to cram on all the brakes they had and to steer around an obsticle the best they could.

At the end of the first year with the BMW, the CHP had not lost one officer to a motorcycle traffic accident.

That was enough to change the bid spec forever. It also explains why every big, slow, wobbling, HD on the force now has ABS.

ABS won't magically save your life in every situation, and the magazines have proven that with practice, the rider can stop faster without it, but when said soccer mom does turn left on front of you, you don't get a do-over.

I am a big time techie, but I am with you on this one. I had rented a fully loaded '17 RT in New Zealand, last November, for 10 days, and I have to say that my deeply ingrained riding instincts will not allow me to even try that feature out! As for preventing accidents, I can't see that, because if you know how to ride properly, you wouldn't be in the position in the first place! What the cornering ABS allow is that one can break those rules, safely, and push the envelope further for better cornering speed performance.

Now, about NZ.

My wife and I did a 14day Edelweiss of both Islands way back in 2005.

Amazing isn't good enough to describe it.

I would go back tomorrow if I could.

At the time, we rode a then new R1150RT, NZ hadn't got the 1200 yet, they were running 2005 RT's.

I miss the bacon, coffee, people, in that order.

I have a 2016 R1200GS with the cornering ABS and I bought that year model because I wanted that feature. If there's technology that can help provide more safety as I ride, then I want it. I'm an experienced, educated rider, but if there's an incident in a corner I want that cornering ABS to help me out. I continually seek rider education and training, wear quality safety gear head to toe, and purchase the bike's with the most advanced safety technology within my budget. To each his own, but that's my riding philosophy.

I am a big time techie, but I am with you on this one. I had rented a fully loaded '17 RT in New Zealand, last November, for 10 days, and I have to say that my deeply ingrained riding instincts will not allow me to even try that feature out! As for preventing accidents, I can't see that, because if you know how to ride properly, you wouldn't be in the position in the first place! What the cornering ABS allow is that one can break those rules, safely, and push the envelope further for better cornering speed performance.

 

Now, about NZ.

My wife and I did a 14day Edelweiss of both Islands way back in 2005.

Amazing isn't good enough to describe it.

I would go back tomorrow if I could.

At the time, we rode a then new R1150RT, NZ hadn't got the 1200 yet, they were running 2005 RT's.

I miss the bacon, coffee, people, in that order.

I grew up there in the '50s and '60s., and learned to ride there! Last year was my first time back since leaving in '69, and it was wonderful. The cost to rent an RT was high, even when compared to renting cost in Scotland, which I did a couple of years back. So, I had the RT for just 10 days, and planned my own routes, but just in the south island. Got several ride videos posted on YouTube!

I am a big time techie, but I am with you on this one. I had rented a fully loaded '17 RT in New Zealand, last November, for 10 days, and I have to say that my deeply ingrained riding instincts will not allow me to even try that feature out! As for preventing accidents, I can't see that, because if you know how to ride properly, you wouldn't be in the position in the first place! What the cornering ABS allow is that one can break those rules, safely, and push the envelope further for better cornering speed performance.

 

All your "deeply ingrained riding instincts" will go right out the window the moment some soccer mom turns left on front of you or you come around a blind corner and a fallen rock or tree limb is in your lane.

 

Way back in late '98-'99 when the California Highway Patrol began receiving the first of the BMW R1100RTP's, the riders raise all kinds of ruckus over the ABS, footpegs, clutch, because they were used to the KZ1000P.

 

Many of the senior officers kept their KZ's to the very end until they were directed to take the BMW getting dusty in the motor pool shed so the KZ could go back to Sac to auction.

 

The CHP Academy has a reputation for being the toughest in the country. Some departments send their officers there because it is the toughest and the riders that come out are some of the best in the U.S.

 

Prior to the RT, even with the antiquated early ABS of the 1100, the accounting office had to "factor in " losing 3 officers a year due to motorcycle traffic accidents.

Obviously, the training had to be modified to suit ABS, instead of "laying it down" etc, the officers were tought to cram on all the brakes they had and to steer around an obsticle the best they could.

 

At the end of the first year with the BMW, the CHP had not lost one officer to a motorcycle traffic accident.

That was enough to change the bid spec forever. It also explains why every big, slow, wobbling, HD on the force now has ABS.

 

ABS won't magically save your life in every situation, and the magazines have proven that with practice, the rider can stop faster without it, but when said soccer mom does turn left on front of you, you don't get a do-over.

Actually, the only close call that I have had was exactly as you said, somebody cut a left in front of me while I was doing about 50 mph, and if it wasn't for the "deep ingrained" instinct, I would have splatted on the side of that minivan! I won't get into the details, but I was braking so hard, on my prior '07 RT, that the rear end had gotten so light that it started to fishtail.....lightly, then the oscillation increased. Quite instinctively (because my full conscious attention was on what to do when I did hit the side of that minivan), I slacked off on the front brake lever and increased pressure on the foot lever, which got the bike's weight more back to the rear, and stopped the fishtailing. In the end I did avoid the collision completely because the minivan driver had the present of mind not to slow down (or didn't see me at all?), and I was able to heel hard over to go around the rear of the van. Another ingrained instinct was that, at no time did I ever "locked" my eyes on that van. If I had, I am sure that I would not have been able to execute the last maneuver to avoid hitting the van. You have to avoid target fixation at all costs!

So on the '07 RT, the ABS did its job then.

One last "book" I promise.

When the CHP first got the RT's the very first traffic accident was in Riverside CA. On University Ave.

I know this because one of the CHP Motors brought the sometimes gruesome CHP magazine in to the dealership I worked at to show us.

On the cover, was a older pickup truck with a new R1100RTP embedded in the front fender almost where the fender meets the cab.

I looked at the picture and said "that's by my Aunt Mary's house!" As my Aunt, at the time lived on Douglass right off Univerisity.

The truck pulled an illegal U turn pulling a gardening trailer on University right in front of a Motor headed to one of the freeways.

He had no time to swerve or evade. He just clamped on the brakes and hit the thing with some force.

The RT stayed upright and did what it is designed to do in a frontal impact, dissipate energy and get the rider up and over the obstical it hit.

The riders knees hit the fairing indents as the telelever collapsed or crumpled, the bars broke away, the plastic screen mechanism broke away when the riders torso hit it, and he did a perfect Superman up and over the truck landing some, if memory serves, twenty, thirty feet away.

Witnesses were horrified to see this of course as they were convinced it was a fatal.

Within seconds, the Officer sprang up, ran back to the truck, and as the door wouldn't open, began to pull the driver out the window.

People who stopped were frantically trying to get the Officer to sit or lay down, just knowing he was gravely injured.

The driver of the truck was, as the Officer figured , intoxicated .

The Officer had bumps and bruises and a slight cut on his knee, and a scrape on his helmet and of course was transported to Hospital to be checked out.

We kept that magazine out of sight from customers and used it occasionally when anti ABS folks came in. More to help educate.

And that was on the pretty primitive ABS of the early bikes that was by today's standards, uh, comical ?

Yes, the same on my beloved RT but I've learned to trust it with its click-chirps, badly timed partial releases, and quirks.

No, the ABS didn't even kicked in. At least, I don't think so. This was in 2014, when I had both my '14 RT and hadn't sold the '07 RT yet. The stop ride notice came out on the '14 RT, and so I was out on the '07. It had new tires, and new brake pads. I don't want to sell my bike with worn parts. I also know the bike well, and know how to brake hard to the point just before the ABS kicked in, but in this case the tires and brakes were doing their jobs very well. Even then, based on the deceleration rate, I was figuring that I was going to hit that van for sure, and trying hard to make the impact velocity as low as possible. You can imagine my relief when I caught sight of the rear of that van in the corner of my eye (I was THAT close!), and let go of both brakes to heel hard over. I was doing about 35 mph, when I looked, after straightening up past the van.

Well, ok then.