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#643767 - 10/09/10 11:53 PM Re: Heard a wind turbine? [Re: Paul Mihalka]  
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 538
RodB Offline
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RodB  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 538
New Brunswick, Canada
Quote:
we see thousands more miles of power lines installed, to the detriment of the landscape

Quote:
I definitely find the looks of long distance power lines much uglier than the wind turbines


Maybe for now, the best we could do about these power lines is something like this.


Rod

2005 R1200RT
2001 F650GS
2009 Ski-doo GTX SE 1200
2011 Ski-doo Expedition Sport-600 ACE
2005 Subaru Outback 3.0R
#643775 - 10/10/10 12:27 AM Re: Heard a wind turbine? [Re: Pilgrim]  
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 661
Groanup Offline
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Groanup  Offline
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 661
Pasadena, CA
Not tying to hijack.
I find this to be interesting, though I have not finished reading it all. You can download the whole book in PDF form for free if interested.
Sustainable energy - Without the hot air


Don R.
Beemin on a Budget
2007 R1200RT Sand Beige Metalic (Sandy)


#643795 - 10/10/10 01:19 AM Re: Heard a wind turbine? [Re: 1springer]  
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 8,287
SageRider Offline
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SageRider  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 8,287
Minden, Nevada
Quote:
As far as reprocessing where would you like that facility placed? Probably not in your backyard.
Reprocessing optimally would be done where the waste is created. Among other things, it minimizes the transportation of hazardous materials.
While my current location has no need for additional power, I lived most of my life in southern California, within 50 miles of San Onofre. I never had a problem with the plant then or now.

Quote:
do seriously believe that no research has gone on over the decades to find a viable way to handle spent fuel

No.
Quote:
and if there currently was do you think the option would have been to take the most difficult solution, i.e., to hollow out a mountain?
I'm sure that the Natl. Labs would be more than will to take research $$'s.

We'll never know what might have been achieved if the billions of dollars spent on Yucca Mountain had been redirected to research.
Yucca Mountain is the end result of political decisions and inertia dating back to 1957.

Quote:
Oddly enough. inspite of many, many atmopheric and below ground nuclear tests less than 60 miles from Las Vegas you all survived and at least when I lived there, were relatively normal.
In fact prospered!

What was the population of the Las Vegas and surrounding area when the majority of the nuclear testing was performed?
What is the population now?
Also, The testing that I am aware of was performed when certain environmental conditions such as wind direction, speed, etc... were met, and relatively low yield / little material was involved.
Even then, check out the link for claims resulting from being downwind of these experiments:
http://www.justice.gov/civil/omp/omi/Tre_SysClaimsToDateSum.pdf


Michael
2010 Unrally IX Sierra Adventures Co-Chair
KE6GYC 2M/440
'12 F800-GS Trophy: (dearly departed)
'06 R1200-RT, Piedmont RED! (dearly departed)
'99 R1100-RT (dearly departed)
Minden, Nevada
#643800 - 10/10/10 01:31 AM Re: Heard a wind turbine? [Re: SageRider]  
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 5,044
Pilgrim Offline
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Pilgrim  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 5,044
Yakima, WA
Originally Posted By: SageRider
Quote:
Yucca Mountain in NV to store high level waste

Yep. The perfect NIMBY solution. Except for Nevada.


Michael, in all seriousness, putting aside the atavistic fear of the unknown and un-understood, what is the downside for storing waste inside one of the most stable geologic formations on earth?

I know there was/is a lot of opposition to it, but in all truth, I never understood why.

I'm working on the assumption that what was to go in there would be vitrified. If that wasn't the case then I can understand a bit better.

Pilgrim


See my book, Tracks in the Sand, online at Signcutter Press, Amazon, or B&N.
#643805 - 10/10/10 01:47 AM Re: Heard a wind turbine? [Re: Pilgrim]  
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 750
ratfink Offline
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ratfink  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 750
vancouver, wa
Originally Posted By: Pilgrim
what is the downside for storing waste inside one of the most stable geologic formations on earth?


The less ativistic among us probably understand the terms "half-life" and "mass wasting".


Regards, RTFink

2000 R1100RT
1999 R1100RT-P
2006 650 V-Strom
2001 DRZ400S
1974 DT175
#643810 - 10/10/10 01:58 AM Re: Heard a wind turbine? [Re: ratfink]  
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 538
RodB Offline
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RodB  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 538
New Brunswick, Canada
Originally Posted By: ratfink
The less ativistic among us probably understand the terms "half-life" and "mass wasting".


I don't even understand 'ativistic'.


Rod

2005 R1200RT
2001 F650GS
2009 Ski-doo GTX SE 1200
2011 Ski-doo Expedition Sport-600 ACE
2005 Subaru Outback 3.0R
#643815 - 10/10/10 02:20 AM Re: Heard a wind turbine? [Re: RodB]  
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 11,539
ShovelStrokeEd Offline
MC Buffer
ShovelStrokeEd  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 11,539
SE Florida
FWIW, there is already considerable research being done at National Labs on just this problem. Treatment and storage of high level nuclear waste.

I have always favored the idea of using our considerable space capabilities to just launch the stuff back into the sun. It would give NASA engineers something to do and probably wouldn't cost all that much more than what we are doing now.


Just as every skill is improved by practice, so also is every bad habit made worse by repetition.

Swim upstream in life, only dead fish go with the flow.
#643818 - 10/10/10 02:28 AM Re: Heard a wind turbine? [Re: RodB]  
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 396
Flyer5 Offline
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Flyer5  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 396
Montrose PA
http://www.localactionpa.org/news/new-nuclear-reactor-at-berwick



This is right near my work , 2015 if all goes well .



I am for nuclear energy ,even though I make my living in the anthracite coal industry .Actually I MFG anthracite burning hearth and heating products.I look at nuclear as well as coal as more independence from foreign oil .Plus we create American jobs. Anthracite is a very clean source of fuel.Oh Yea in N.E.P.A. we have a lot of wind turbines I think they are great as well . Dave

Last edited by Flyer5; 10/10/10 02:37 AM.

Current rides 2000R1100RT Black
Quicksilver MXL Sport 2 Light sport aircraft
#643833 - 10/10/10 02:59 AM Re: Heard a wind turbine? [Re: ShovelStrokeEd]  
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,320
Jerry_75_Guy Offline
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Jerry_75_Guy  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 1,320
Fishers Ind., USA
Originally Posted By: ShovelStrokeEd
I have always favored the idea of using our considerable space capabilities to just launch the stuff back into the sun.


Me too (really), but the fact that smarter people than I weren't, apparently, seriously considering the idea, lead me to think that I must have been ignoring some basic math that might get in the way. Dunno.

[hijack]I like the Frank Herbert reference Mitch thumbsup
[end hijack]


IBA# 23660

"You can't have everything; where would you put it?"
also Steven Wright
--------------------------------------------
'93 K1100LT (sold: I miss that bike)
'01 R1100RTSE
'01 VFR800FI
#643836 - 10/10/10 03:13 AM Re: Heard a wind turbine? [Re: SageRider]  
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 333
1springer Offline
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1springer  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 333
Soggy Bottom, WA
Originally Posted By: SageRider
Quote:
As far as reprocessing where would you like that facility placed? Probably not in your backyard.
Reprocessing optimally would be done where the waste is created. Among other things, it minimizes the transportation of hazardous materials.
While my current location has no need for additional power, I lived most of my life in southern California, within 50 miles of San Onofre. I never had a problem with the plant then or now.

Quote:
do seriously believe that no research has gone on over the decades to find a viable way to handle spent fuel

No.
Quote:
and if there currently was do you think the option would have been to take the most difficult solution, i.e., to hollow out a mountain?
I'm sure that the Natl. Labs would be more than will to take research $$'s.

We'll never know what might have been achieved if the billions of dollars spent on Yucca Mountain had been redirected to research.
Yucca Mountain is the end result of political decisions and inertia dating back to 1957.

Quote:
Oddly enough. inspite of many, many atmopheric and below ground nuclear tests less than 60 miles from Las Vegas you all survived and at least when I lived there, were relatively normal.
In fact prospered!

What was the population of the Las Vegas and surrounding area when the majority of the nuclear testing was performed?
What is the population now?
Also, The testing that I am aware of was performed when certain environmental conditions such as wind direction, speed, etc... were met, and relatively low yield / little material was involved.
Even then, check out the link for claims resulting from being downwind of these experiments:
http://www.justice.gov/civil/omp/omi/Tre_SysClaimsToDateSum.pdf


"Reprocessing optimally would be done where the waste is created. Among other things, it minimizes the transportation of hazardous materials.
While my current location has no need for additional power, I lived most of my life in southern California, within 50 miles of San Onofre. I never had a problem with the plant then or now."

Yes, by all means lets have many facilities handling hazerdous materials instead of one centralized location. Forget the cost and transportation is a problem?

"We'll never know what might have been achieved if the billions of dollars spent on Yucca Mountain had been redirected to research.
Yucca Mountain is the end result of political decisions and inertia dating back to 1957."

Yes and we will never know what would have happened if I had become a Dentist instead of N. Engineer or where I'd be today if only I had invested in Zerox or Microsoft. Yucca or any site for that matter and poltics? I'm shocked....shocked I say!

"What was the population of the Las Vegas and surrounding area when the majority of the nuclear testing was performed?
What is the population now?
Also, The testing that I am aware of was performed when certain environmental conditions such as wind direction, speed, etc... were met, and relatively low yield / little material was involved"

What does population have to do with it? Unless I've forgotten the basics there is a big difference between detonation hazards and storage of high level waste.
Yes, there were very strict environmental condition to be met before a test. Were there problems, yes, I'm well aware of the "downwinders". But as far as I know the waste isn't going to be thrown into the back of a pick-up and driven haphazard across the desert. Have you seen the casks used to transport low level waste to NM?

What do you consider low yield/ little material?

Just as an aside I hope no one is taking offense at these comments. Just fun to argue. smile


2013 Triumph Tiger 800
04 1150 RT ( sold )
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