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#694765 - 05/05/11 07:57 AM Final Drive Oil Change
Tourbike Offline
Member

Registered: 05/29/05
Posts: 80
Loc: North Carolina
What is the current BMW recommended oil change frequency for the final drive on the 1200RT? And, isn't the volume now 180ml?
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Andy
2008 R1200RT

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#694782 - 05/05/11 08:48 AM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Tourbike]
hopz Offline
Member

Registered: 08/21/05
Posts: 3394
Loc: Colorado Springs, CO
180=yes

I do not know the year of your bike, but I do mine at the 6k service.

This is a link to the job if you have a bike with no drain plug. If you do have a drain plug it may be simpler, but not as much fun.
http://bmwsporttouring.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=131174&page=1
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R1200RT
R1100S

Assumption is the Mother of all screw ups.

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#694804 - 05/05/11 10:04 AM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: hopz]
RedMac Offline
Member

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 738
Loc: West Bend, WI
Even if it has a drain plug, I like to drop it and lube the splines...
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There are only 10 kinds of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't - unknown
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Mike - IBA #38151
06 R1200RT
99 K1200RS - Gone but not forgotten

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#694808 - 05/05/11 10:13 AM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Tourbike]
dirtrider Offline
The Oracle
Member

Registered: 06/05/10
Posts: 8308
Loc: Ohio
Morning Andy

I know this doesnít directly answer your question.


A good safe and easy way is to change the final drive gear oil at every rear tire change. The rear wheel needs to come off anyway so you are over half way through the final drive service.

Thatís a bit early but is a good way to keep an eye on whatís happening inside your final drive.
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#694812 - 05/05/11 10:40 AM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: dirtrider]
Tourbike Offline
Member

Registered: 05/29/05
Posts: 80
Loc: North Carolina
Doing the change when you need a new rear tire makes sense to me. I use Shinko tires and get close to 11k - 12k miles on the rear.
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Andy
2008 R1200RT

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#694877 - 05/05/11 03:22 PM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: RedMac]
mxharris Offline
Member

Registered: 09/08/09
Posts: 58
Loc: Manitoba, Canada
What type of lube for the splines?
Thanks.
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Mike Harris
'05 R1200RT
'10 KLR650
'03 KLX300R

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#694912 - 05/05/11 07:23 PM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: mxharris]
Herkypilot Offline
Newer Member

Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 15
Loc: Concord, NC
Get some of the Honda Moly60 that's about the best stuff according to many. I bought a small cartridge which will last for years.

HP

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#694977 - 05/06/11 06:51 AM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Herkypilot]
RedMac Offline
Member

Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 738
Loc: West Bend, WI
+1 on the Honda moly lube. That's what I use...
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There are only 10 kinds of people in the world, those who understand binary and those who don't - unknown
----------------------
Mike - IBA #38151
06 R1200RT
99 K1200RS - Gone but not forgotten

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#694990 - 05/06/11 08:07 AM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: RedMac]
Tourbike Offline
Member

Registered: 05/29/05
Posts: 80
Loc: North Carolina
But, how often does BMW now recommend that you change the FD oil?
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Andy
2008 R1200RT

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#694992 - 05/06/11 08:16 AM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Tourbike]
Jerry Duke Offline
Member

Registered: 04/10/03
Posts: 946
Loc: Savannah, GA
For a few weeks they claimed the oil was good for the life of the unit. Then the units seemed to be failing so they changed their minds....
Experienced people told you their opinion, what does your manual say? Maybe you need to contact BMW.

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#695003 - 05/06/11 08:56 AM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Tourbike]
dirtrider Offline
The Oracle
Member

Registered: 06/05/10
Posts: 8308
Loc: Ohio
Morning Andy

Last service sheet I have shows the final drive oil change at every 2 years or 20,000 KM. There might be a later service sheet (Maintenance Schedule) available though so call your dealer and have them pull up the latest Maintenance Schedule for you.
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#695006 - 05/06/11 09:04 AM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Tourbike]
randys Offline
Member

Registered: 08/04/03
Posts: 1000
Loc: Cocoa, Florida
I just had my final drive rebuilt with new bearings. The service manger told me to change the fluid every 12K OR once a year, 180cc .
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Take care, ride safe

Randy

1200GS

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#695066 - 05/06/11 12:39 PM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: randys]
marcopolo Offline
Member

Registered: 11/28/03
Posts: 3481
Loc: Alexandria, VA/Ottawa, Canada
The latest maintenance schedule I have is for the so-called "BMW Inspection" (carried out every 20,000 kms) and it's the 12/2009 version. One of the items is "Changing oil in rear-wheel drive". It says nothing on the schedule for that item about a time interval, though that's not to say there's not a more recent schedule since every two years is noted above. I have my bike serviced by an independent tech. The Castrol SAF-XO gear oil for the FD costs $14, and the labour is included in the two hours he charges for the "Inspection".


Edited by marcopolo (05/06/11 12:43 PM)
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Mark
2006 R1200RT

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#695085 - 05/06/11 02:09 PM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: marcopolo]
brianbmw Offline
Member

Registered: 08/22/07
Posts: 470
Loc: Central Massachusetts
In 2005 wasn't it supposed to be lifetime oil? I do mine every 6000.

Brian

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#695115 - 05/06/11 04:14 PM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: brianbmw]
marcopolo Offline
Member

Registered: 11/28/03
Posts: 3481
Loc: Alexandria, VA/Ottawa, Canada
Originally Posted By: brianbmw
In 2005 wasn't it supposed to be lifetime oil? I do mine every 6000.

Brian


Yes. Then BMW changed it to once, at the 600-mile service. Then they changed to the routine (every 20,000 km) interval, and reduced the fill quantity for an oil change to 180 ml.


Edited by marcopolo (05/06/11 04:14 PM)
_________________________
Mark
2006 R1200RT

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#695142 - 05/06/11 05:41 PM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Tourbike]
JAP Offline
Newer Member

Registered: 08/21/07
Posts: 35
Loc: Punto Fijo Edo Falcon Venezue...
We recently changed a FD on a GSA, the new one came with oil and ready, we found that afther draining, but the point is that the factory oil was dark and there was metallic dust on the magnetic collector, so afther a 1500km trip we changed the oil again, this time the oil looks better and there was not so significant acumulation on the magnetic collector. We decided to keep checking afther the next long trip and every engine oil change. Our conclussion is that breaking process on the FD deteriorates the oil much earlier than indicated, causing premature failure, to prevent this the oil has to be changed much more frecuently than recomended by manual.
Best regards
JAP

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#695159 - 05/06/11 06:13 PM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Tourbike]
dirtrider Offline
The Oracle
Member

Registered: 06/05/10
Posts: 8308
Loc: Ohio
Afternoon JAP

Theyíre all dark like that on first oil change BMW puts some sort of Moly in the original gear oil, probably for gear tooth break-in. Nothing abnormal in what you found.
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#695165 - 05/06/11 07:02 PM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: dirtrider]
JAP Offline
Newer Member

Registered: 08/21/07
Posts: 35
Loc: Punto Fijo Edo Falcon Venezue...
Originally Posted By: dirtrider
Afternoon JAP

Theyíre all dark like that on first oil change BMW puts some sort of Moly in the original gear oil, probably for gear tooth break-in. Nothing abnormal in what you found.


Hi, that makes sense, but the amount of metallic dust on a brand new FD, and the poor record for those FDs, the bike in question had barely 25000km when the FD failed. The new FD was almost 1800$ exworks plus shipping. Makes me feel more confortable changing the oil more frecuently.
Thanks for your kind tip, we were not even sure if the factory oil was the working one or only for storage.
Best regards
JAP

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#695202 - 05/06/11 10:21 PM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Tourbike]
Joe Frickin' Friday Offline

Administrator
Member

Registered: 07/28/00
Posts: 16934
Loc: Ann Arbor, MI (USA)
2009 R1200RT here. I understand you fill through the ABS sensor. Does the drain plug need a crush washer? If so, anyone know what size? I have a bunch of crush washers left over from my 1100RT, and I wonder if one of them might fit.
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Mitch
"VENI VIDI VEHI"
I've got Mojolevers for sale!
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#695245 - 05/07/11 06:28 AM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Tourbike]
terryofperry Offline
Member

Registered: 01/11/08
Posts: 503
Mitch

Correct me if I am wrong but a 2009 should have a seperate fill plug, not the sensor.

Terry
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Terry

Perry,GA

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#695248 - 05/07/11 06:49 AM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Joe Frickin' Friday]
lawnchairboy Offline
Snuggie Jesus
Member

Registered: 11/14/05
Posts: 2895
Loc: Chesapeake, Virginia
Mitch:

their is a rubber o-ring on my plug in an 06.
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06 R12RT 05 DR650 11 R12GS


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#695257 - 05/07/11 07:39 AM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Joe Frickin' Friday]
dirtrider Offline
The Oracle
Member

Registered: 06/05/10
Posts: 8308
Loc: Ohio
Originally Posted By: Joe Frickin' Friday
2009 R1200RT here. I understand you fill through the ABS sensor. Does the drain plug need a crush washer? If so, anyone know what size? I have a bunch of crush washers left over from my 1100RT, and I wonder if one of them might fit.


Morning Mitch

There is a fill plug but you still have to remove the rear wheel to get to it. You can almost get it with the wheel on but risk wheel damage trying.






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D.R. ___
Sent from my rotory dial wall phone!

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#695298 - 05/07/11 11:39 AM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Joe Frickin' Friday]
JAP Offline
Newer Member

Registered: 08/21/07
Posts: 35
Loc: Punto Fijo Edo Falcon Venezue...
Originally Posted By: Joe Frickin' Friday
2009 R1200RT here. I understand you fill through the ABS sensor. Does the drain plug need a crush washer? If so, anyone know what size? I have a bunch of crush washers left over from my 1100RT, and I wonder if one of them might fit.

Hi, there is a filler plug so you do not have to mess with the sensor. Drain plug has an o ring, dont remember a washer, anyway it was not neccesary to replace any hardware. Only thing was filler plug and drain were not the same, one was allen an other torx.
Best regards
JAP

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#695403 - 05/07/11 11:21 PM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Tourbike]
macx Offline
Member

Registered: 03/29/11
Posts: 438
Loc: Cape Girardeau, MO home workin...
Whew! When I read that some bikes don't have a FD drain plug, I ran right out and took a good look at mine.

TGFSM! Mine has one. (2011)
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56k since 5/1/11 on my 1200RT - LOTS of scenery within 500 miles of Vegas all directions! Retiring in WY next year.
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#695454 - 05/08/11 09:07 AM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Tourbike]
hopz Offline
Member

Registered: 08/21/05
Posts: 3394
Loc: Colorado Springs, CO
drain plugs are for wussies.
_________________________
R1200RT
R1100S

Assumption is the Mother of all screw ups.

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#695545 - 05/08/11 06:15 PM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Tourbike]
Joe Frickin' Friday Offline

Administrator
Member

Registered: 07/28/00
Posts: 16934
Loc: Ann Arbor, MI (USA)
Changed my FD oil this weekend.

The official BMW service manual specifies "Castrol SAF-XO" gear oil for the final drive. After checking auto parts stores near my home, I gave up and went to the BMW dealer - who handed me standard 75W-90/GL5 gear oil. Crap, I could have gotten that a mile from my house, for a lot less than $25.

On the plus side: a drain plug with an O-ring. Finally, don't need a crush washer every time I change the fluid. Yay!


On the minus side:

- a fill plug that can't be accessed without pulling the rear wheel - and even then, access is difficult through the brake rotor. You really need a syringe, and I couldn't find one in this town. Well, pharmacies did stock syringes, but they were only 10ml-capacity, intended for feeding gear oil to infants. I wasn't sure I could count to 18 without screwing up, so I opted to sacrifice one of our turkey basters - the crappy one, since we wanted to save the good one for cooking. The crappy one made the job a real PITA. As it turns out, it seems to be only able to reliably suck up about 10ml of fluid at a time - same as the infant feeder from the pharmacy (except that would have been easier to use).

-a fill plug that still requires a crush washer. Why on earth would you design the drain plug with an O-ring, but not the fill plug???

-a fill plug that uses hex keys, when every other damn bolt on the bike is Torx. WTF, over?

-the dealer, 20 miles away, who sold me the wrong damn crush washer for the job. I come all the way there and pay top dollar for their expertise in BMW motorcycles, and this is what I get? Sheesh. I ended up reusing the existing washer.
_________________________
Mitch
"VENI VIDI VEHI"
I've got Mojolevers for sale!
PLEASE GIVE BLOOD

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#695558 - 05/08/11 07:03 PM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Joe Frickin' Friday]
Dundee387 Offline
Member

Registered: 04/18/07
Posts: 276
Loc: Connecticut
I use a hair coloring applicator from a beauty supply shop. It cost a buck or two, and it has ml. measuring labeled on it, so you know how much your putting in (180). Also has a long, thin, plastic tip. perfect for the job. I think it is mentioned in the JVB video.

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#695559 - 05/08/11 07:13 PM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Joe Frickin' Friday]
dirtrider Offline
The Oracle
Member

Registered: 06/05/10
Posts: 8308
Loc: Ohio

Evening Mitch

A 69 cent funnel and a piece of hose makes the job ever so easy. You can use a precision measuring cup then just pour it in through the funnel/hose.



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D.R. ___
Sent from my rotory dial wall phone!

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#695584 - 05/08/11 08:14 PM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Tourbike]
siman00 Offline
Member

Registered: 08/01/07
Posts: 626
Loc: Clayton, NC
This is a stupid question, but I'll ask anyway. Why can't you use the "drain" plug (the one at about 10 o'clock) to add fluid? Seems that if it can be used to drain the fluid (on models before the bottom plug), it could be used to put oil back in.

Why not?
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09 1200 RT Beautiful Black; 01 R 1200 C Phoenix; 05 1200 RT (Sold)

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#695587 - 05/08/11 08:25 PM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Tourbike]
dirtrider Offline
The Oracle
Member

Registered: 06/05/10
Posts: 8308
Loc: Ohio
Evening siman00


Probably could now that the oil level has been reduced. I think at level final drive the bottom of that drain hole should be close to 180cc or so.

The big problem would be getting all the oil in without spilling any (so you know how much went in). The ring gear is mighty close to that rear drain plug hole so it wouldnít be that difficult to get it to belch some of the oil out as you fill it as there is no external vent.
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#695588 - 05/08/11 08:28 PM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: siman00]
Paul Mihalka Offline
Old Fart
Member

Registered: 07/20/00
Posts: 12058
Loc: Sykesville, MD
I think that to use the "10 o'clock" drain plug for draining you would like to remove the ABS sensor anyways to get some air in. That hole is small and it would take forever to drain. I understand that with the new 180cc fill volume that drain plug acts as a oil level when the rear drive is installed. What I do is that after draining I re-install the rear drive and start filling through the ABS sensor hole simply with hand operated oil gun until oil comes out the drain hole. Plug up everything and you are done.
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Age is a issue of mind over matter. If you don't mind, it doesn't matter... (Mark Twain)
Many years and 1 million (s)miles.

'05 R1200GS lotsa miles (sold)
'09 Yamaha Majesty - yes, a scooter

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#695595 - 05/08/11 09:13 PM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: siman00]
Kitsap Offline
Member

Registered: 03/13/03
Posts: 2502
Originally Posted By: siman00
This is a stupid question, but I'll ask anyway. Why can't you use the "drain" plug (the one at about 10 o'clock) to add fluid? Seems that if it can be used to drain the fluid (on models before the bottom plug), it could be used to put oil back in.

Why not?


You can, I just did it yesterday. I change my FD oil and lube the splines at every tire change, too often for some but I like the feeling of Honda Moly 60 on my fingers.
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Wade
IBA #37945

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#696408 - 05/11/11 09:22 PM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Kitsap]
longjohn Offline
Member

Registered: 08/26/09
Posts: 1039
Loc: lax
Originally Posted By: Kitsap
Originally Posted By: siman00
This is a stupid question, but I'll ask anyway. Why can't you use the "drain" plug (the one at about 10 o'clock) to add fluid? Seems that if it can be used to drain the fluid (on models before the bottom plug), it could be used to put oil back in.

Why not?


You can, I just did it yesterday. I change my FD oil and lube the splines at every tire change, too often for some but I like the feeling of Honda Moly 60 on my fingers.


Me too. Every 12k
_________________________
John

2005 R1200RT 3.8k 31k and rising
1990 PC 800 (dying) 100+k
1979 Yamaha XS750F (sold) 79k
Large avatar


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#697106 - 05/15/11 12:58 AM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Tourbike]
duckboy Offline
Member

Registered: 12/16/06
Posts: 55
i change the FD fluid with every engine oil change or rear tire change. FD fluid's cheap. FD's aren't.

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#697159 - 05/15/11 11:00 AM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: Tourbike]
SuperG Offline
Member

Registered: 02/19/10
Posts: 1007
Loc: Central Texas
Some of the knowledgeable folks here said it many times; the FD uses sealed bearings, FD oil does not lube the bearing. FD rarely fail because of FD lube. Bearings (crown and pinions) puke out first. Changing out the FD lube can not hurt, but premature lube swap based on fear of FD failure is simple waste of $$.

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#697193 - 05/15/11 02:51 PM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: SuperG]
Lawman Offline
Member

Registered: 03/22/04
Posts: 3604
Loc: Joaquin, Texas
Originally Posted By: Sustengo?
Some of the knowledgeable folks here said it many times; the FD uses sealed bearings, FD oil does not lube the bearing. FD rarely fail because of FD lube. Bearings (crown and pinions) puke out first. Changing out the FD lube can not hurt, but premature lube swap based on fear of FD failure is simple waste of $$.


It's good to see someone say what I've been thinking.. thumbsup There's a greater chance I'll screw something up trying to fix something that ain't broken than there is I'll prevent something bad from happening that likely ain't gonna happen.. grin
_________________________
Billy Hearnsberger
2005 R1200RT
Life is good. Then you die.

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#697232 - 05/15/11 04:46 PM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: SuperG]
dirtrider Offline
The Oracle
Member

Registered: 06/05/10
Posts: 8308
Loc: Ohio
Originally Posted By: Sustengo?
Some of the knowledgeable folks here said it many times; the FD uses sealed bearings, FD oil does not lube the bearing. FD rarely fail because of FD lube. Bearings (crown and pinions) puke out first. Changing out the FD lube can not hurt, but premature lube swap based on fear of FD failure is simple waste of $$.


Afternoon Sustengo?

I think you misunderstood what was said about the hexhead final drive bearings. Only ONE bearing in the hexhead final drive is sealed and that is the large crown bearing. The R/H spool bearing is a large needle setup that does run in the gear oil as well as both pinion bearing run directly in the gear oil.

What has been posted is there are very few internal bearing failures on the heaxhead final drive (well after BMW increased the size of the rear pinion bearing anyway). The one bearing that does seem to still fail occasionally is the crown bearing and that is the sealed bearing that runs outside the gear oil chamber.

On the early hexhead final drives with the smaller rear pinion bearing it probably isnít a bad idea to change the gear oil a little more often to see if any debris from that rear bearing comes out in the drained gear oil.
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D.R. ___
Sent from my rotory dial wall phone!

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#697246 - 05/15/11 06:00 PM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: dirtrider]
DiggerJim Offline
Member

Registered: 08/31/05
Posts: 1713
Loc: Simsbury, CT
Originally Posted By: dirtrider
On the early hexhead final drives with the smaller rear pinion bearing it probably isnít a bad idea to change the gear oil a little more often to see if any debris from that rear bearing comes out in the drained gear oil.
When did they make the change?
_________________________
----------
Jim
2007 R1200RT Bairritz Blue - hexhead 1200
2000 R1200C Ice (Frost) Blue - oilhead 1200
1996 CBR600 Joe Camel Special - hooligan bike
1986 KZ650 Green - classic old school
IBA #35635

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#697247 - 05/15/11 06:04 PM Re: Final Drive Oil Change [Re: DiggerJim]
dirtrider Offline
The Oracle
Member

Registered: 06/05/10
Posts: 8308
Loc: Ohio
Originally Posted By: DiggerJim
Originally Posted By: dirtrider
On the early hexhead final drives with the smaller rear pinion bearing it probably isnít a bad idea to change the gear oil a little more often to see if any debris from that rear bearing comes out in the drained gear oil.
When did they make the change?


Evening Jim

Sometime around August of 06 (BUT) that assumes that BMW didnít have some early leftovers that they worked into later production.
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