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#760581 - 02/19/12 11:03 AM Re: Do you own the air space above your property? [Re: barryd]
lkchris Offline
Member

Registered: 11/19/02
Posts: 804
Loc: NM USA
Originally Posted By: barryd
OTH, there are laws about taking potshots at aircraft too.


And you really can't legally shoot somebody just standing on your property, either. And don't shine a laser light in a pilot's eyes, either.
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#760608 - 02/19/12 02:58 PM Re: Do you own the air space above your property? [Re: barryd]
upflying Offline
Member

Registered: 11/10/02
Posts: 6557
Loc: Reno, NV
Originally Posted By: barryd
This is interesting, yet another case where technology has overtaken law and social norms.

I've heard many anecdotal stories of pilots getting in trouble for spending too much time overflying sun bathing women and such, or flying too low to get a better look.

I don't know what the rules say, but if there are such restrictions it would seem to apply to these remotely piloted aircraft too.

There are certainly minimum altitude requirements for aircraft, but if these things are considered models, for example, then altitude restrictions probably don't apply.

OTH, there are laws about taking potshots at aircraft too.

Interesting can of worms.


You are correct, the FAA, NTSB and the Department of Transportation do not regulate RC aircraft equipped with video. At most it's a violation of privacy..handled in civil courts.
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Reno,NV

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#760622 - 02/19/12 04:23 PM Re: Do you own the air space above your property? [Re: upflying]
Rocer Offline
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Registered: 10/21/08
Posts: 1102
Loc: Haliburton ON
It might not be just your neighbours RC that you shoot down.
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Riding my thin place
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#760625 - 02/19/12 04:50 PM Re: Do you own the air space above your property? [Re: Rocer]
Skywagon Offline
Member

Registered: 03/05/07
Posts: 1418
Loc: Bellaire Texas

Can't speak to RC. Don't think a drone would be considered an RC. Per the FAR's you can see the regulations below. Basically over a house need to be a minimum of 1000ft. If the drone can't safely land with engine failure, needs to be higher than that.

If you think the FAA can't get their nickers in a wad over RC, go fly your RC near an airport... I don't know the rules for that even though I have veen an RC guy for 20 years

91.119 Minimum safe altitudes: General.
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Except when necessary for takeoff or landing, no person may operate an aircraft below the following altitudes:

(a) Anywhere. An altitude allowing, if a power unit fails, an emergency landing without undue hazard to persons or property on the surface.

(b) Over congested areas. Over any congested area of a city, town, or settlement, or over any open air assembly of persons, an altitude of 1,000 feet above the highest obstacle within a horizontal radius of 2,000 feet of the aircraft.
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#760631 - 02/19/12 05:20 PM Re: Do you own the air space above your property? [Re: pbharvey]
DavidEBSmith Offline
Eebie
Member

Registered: 03/19/01
Posts: 6141
Loc: Chicago, IL USA
The Constitution doesn't say anything about air rights.
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#760637 - 02/19/12 06:33 PM Re: Do you own the air space above your property? [Re: DavidEBSmith]
chrisd Offline
Member

Registered: 03/26/03
Posts: 899
Loc: HI
The Supreme Court says it does. U.S. v. Causby
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#760648 - 02/19/12 07:38 PM Re: Do you own the air space above your property? [Re: pbharvey]
aterry1067 Offline
Member

Registered: 10/02/10
Posts: 169
Loc: Southern Maryland
This is a scenario where laws are certainly not able to keep up with technology.

The technology available to the general public that could be carried on an RC helicopter is one thing (although that is advancing faster and further by the day). A real UAV is something totally different, and should not be taken lightly.
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#760715 - 02/20/12 09:42 AM Re: Do you own the air space above your property? [Re: Skywagon]
Mister Tee Offline
Member

Registered: 10/24/07
Posts: 1946
Loc: Northern California
Originally Posted By: Skywagon

Can't speak to RC. Don't think a drone would be considered an RC. Per the FAR's you can see the regulations below. Basically over a house need to be a minimum of 1000ft. If the drone can't safely land with engine failure, needs to be higher than that.

If you think the FAA can't get their nickers in a wad over RC, go fly your RC near an airport... I don't know the rules for that even though I have veen an RC guy for 20 years

91.119 Minimum safe altitudes: General.
top
Except when necessary for takeoff or landing, no person may operate an aircraft below the following altitudes:

(a) Anywhere. An altitude allowing, if a power unit fails, an emergency landing without undue hazard to persons or property on the surface.

(b) Over congested areas. Over any congested area of a city, town, or settlement, or over any open air assembly of persons, an altitude of 1,000 feet above the highest obstacle within a horizontal radius of 2,000 feet of the aircraft.



With respect to airspace "ownership", one can argue that ATC (FAA/U.S. Government) "owns" all airspace to the surface except for class G airspace, of which there is not a whole lot in the continental U.S.

This http://www.flytandem.com/airspace.htm provides a simplified breakdown for those unfamiliar.

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#760811 - 02/20/12 03:43 PM Re: Do you own the air space above your property? [Re: Joe Frickin' Friday]
Tom F. (formerly boney) Offline
Member

Registered: 04/08/03
Posts: 4188
Loc: Sonoma, CA
Originally Posted By: Joe Frickin' Friday


interesting

Quote:
typically 500 to 1,000 feet above the ground.


Quote:
you've got air rights only insofar as they're essential to the use and enjoyment of your land.


So basically, a drone which when used for it's intended purpose of spying on the uses of said private land strays over the property at an altitude of less than 500 feet, it is indeed violating the air space of the property owner.

Now the question begs, would you rather defend yourself from a lawsuit after shooting down the aircraft, or sue the offenders for invasion of privacy?
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#760814 - 02/20/12 03:57 PM Re: Do you own the air space above your property? [Re: Tom F. (formerly boney)]
Danny caddyshack Noonan Offline
Member

Registered: 08/16/08
Posts: 2141
Loc: El Dorado Hills, CA
Quote:
Now the question begs, would you rather defend yourself from a lawsuit after shooting down the aircraft, or sue the offenders for invasion of privacy?


Thanks for the idea Boney!

Sir, my autonomouse aircraft was enjoying my airspace over my property when it accidentally ran into, and destroyed, the ROV that was intruding on my airspace. Must have been one of those hardened steel blades that it hit. Since it landed on my property, it's mine now....or was until it fell into the outdoor fireplace.
Sometimes, things happen.
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