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#761980 - 02/26/12 10:17 AM Re: ESA Shocks! [Re: GoldenK9]
bobbybob Offline
Member

Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 2356
Loc: Charlotte, NC
Originally Posted By: GoldenK9
It's been several years since I complained about the BMW ESA suspension on my '05 R1200RT, with a grand total of 16,800 miles on the odometer. Due to several health issues including 3 surgeries to my right wrist (from a klutz fall), a surgery to repair a torn right rotator cuff (another klutz fall) and a totally unexpected right hip replacement last August, I haven't gotten much riding in. Now that I can, and do, ride again it seems like those shocks are worse than ever. The bike rides like it has 100 lbs in the tires, even on 1 up comfort setting. I can't really tell much difference on any setting. Back in '08 the entire suspension was upgraded to the newer ('07 onward) type. Still not much difference, at all. Am I the only one out there having this problem? I love the bike! I hate the suspension. With all of my medical bills right now, I can't afford to step up to Wilber's for a while. Just thought I'd throw this out there. It's so frustrating. cry


Sounds just like my '07 RT with ESA. Around 20K miles the ESA settings really didn't DO anything any longer. Except make the ride even harder in sport mode. What a joke. Traded it shortly thereafter on a 2010 R12GS.

Now, on my OTHER '07 RT which had non-ESA shocks, those babies were toast by 10K and I swapped them out for Ohlins. Now have about 40K on it and its a keeper with the Ohlins! Really transformed the handling. thumbsup


Edited by bobbybob (02/26/12 10:19 AM)
_________________________
Bob
2010 R12000GS
2007 R1200RT (gone)
2008 KLR650 (gone)
2007 F650GS (gone)
2006 FJR1300 (gone)
2005 V-Strom (gone)
2005 E-Glide Classic (gone)

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#761982 - 02/26/12 10:21 AM Re: ESA Shocks! [Re: I812]
ESokoloff Offline
MR. Sweet Pea
Member

Registered: 06/10/03
Posts: 5580
Loc: SoCal
Originally Posted By: I812

better?


Not at all.

Around here that technique is called Cross Controling.

Draw a straight line through the middle of the the rear tire and tail light that extends up past your helmet.
You will find that the majority of your body is to the outside of the corner. Also hard to tell for sure but it looks like your elbows are a bit too straight. They should be looser.
As an example look at this image.
Note that my body is positioned to the inside of the corner.
Advance the frames to the side view and you will note loose elbows.
Also note the abundance of clearance under the bike.
I still have lots of lean angle left if needed.

Learn more here.
_________________________
Eric

============

GM267

PM31613

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#761991 - 02/26/12 10:52 AM Re: ESA Shocks! [Re: GoldenK9]
w2ge Offline
Member

Registered: 01/15/11
Posts: 740
Loc: Voorhees, NJ
If I may... also notice Erics feet.. his feet are positioned on the balls of his feet... with this, you can lift you body easily to shift your butt on the seat...as well as give your feet more clearance if you have to really lean the bike.

and regarding the elbows...(another point why it is good stuff) on hard braking, a big mistake is the STIFF arms that most riders do to keep their upper body from moving forward.. what this does is transfer even more weight onto the front end of the bike (and lightening the rear).. you want the body to rest of the tank, with loose arms to lessen the forward weight transfer.. not easy, but it will help on hard braking into a corner. (keeps the weight more in the center of the bike, stop faster)

After reading the link with using the elbows to steer, part of body positioning is the the inside shoulder should/would dip with proper countersteering... that is, in a left hand turn, left elbow/hand pushing the bars, the left should dipped, leading into the turn.. with rigid, body arms.. this doesn't happen.

I raced off-road for many years (Enduro's- Meteor Motoryclce Club, oldest continuous endure club in US, featured in most recent issue of AMA mag, btw smile so.. I've had to learn, change quite a bit for on-road riding.. so I feel ya' 1812... with the learned off-road upper body habits.


SORRY OFF-TOPIC... back to our regularly scheduled programming


Edited by w2ge (02/26/12 11:10 AM)
_________________________
Phil
2010 R1200RT - 2011 Husqvarna TE310 "Woods Weapon"
NEW SWEDEN BMW RIDERS
iPhone 5>ZUMO 660>SENA SMH10
2014 M-B E350 4MATIC LUXURY
2008 Lexus LS460L Long Edition

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#761998 - 02/26/12 11:27 AM Re: ESA Shocks! [Re: w2ge]
I812 Offline
Member

Registered: 06/07/07
Posts: 465
Loc: Chicago area
I appreciate all your help for the helpless!
I ride in SW WI more then any other area and gravel in corners abound like no other(not including riding gravel roads).
The photo's I posted are 3 years old and I have changed my ways by following Dean Lear around the Appalachia's. The roads there offer less gravel more smiles!:)
I hope my new Avatar is acceptable...:)


Edited by I812 (02/26/12 11:33 AM)
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BMW'S ARE THE WORST BIKE IN THE WORLD, CEPT' WHEN YOU COMPARE THEM TO EVERYTHING ELSE!

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#762014 - 02/26/12 01:10 PM Re: ESA Shocks! [Re: GoldenK9]
Alfred02 Offline
Member

Registered: 05/12/11
Posts: 855
Loc: NSW Mid North Coast Australia
Same bike as the original poster, 05 1200RT with ESA and 37000km on the clock (just purchased recently).
ESA works just fine.
Some posters seem to expect a bit too much. Comparing Ohlins, which most likely have been set up for their weight, to a bike that it produced in thousands where a middle ground has been chosen for millions of possible rider combinations.
_________________________
BMW 2014 R1200RT-SE/LC
BMW 2005 R1200RT-SE (Traded in 03-2014)
BMW 2004 R1150RT (Traded in 02-2012)

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#762061 - 02/26/12 05:18 PM Re: ESA Shocks! [Re: Alfred02]
bobbybob Offline
Member

Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 2356
Loc: Charlotte, NC
Originally Posted By: Alfred02
Same bike as the original poster, 05 1200RT with ESA and 37000km on the clock (just purchased recently).
ESA works just fine.
Some posters seem to expect a bit too much. Comparing Ohlins, which most likely have been set up for their weight, to a bike that it produced in thousands where a middle ground has been chosen for millions of possible rider combinations.


Alfred, its the damping circuits that wear out prematurely, not "too soft springs" which I think you are referring to. If yours works "just fine" with 20K+ miles, great, and I know others here have also had similar experience to yours. But many more have been very disappointed as I have. With ESA, if the spring sags too much, you can hit the pre-load button and correct for it; but when the rebound damping starts fading away, not much you can do. To be honest with you, the damping on my ESA bike started feeling piss-poor around 12K (it was my wife's bike) but I pretended it was fine, until (at 20K) she rebelled one day & just refused to ride it any longer. We then swapped bikes for the rest of that ride, and after that it was traded on the GS the next week. So I guess both of us expected too much. dopeslap


PS: as far as I812's riding posture, I think he's doing great and having fun, which is what its all about!! clap (but put the balls of your feet on the pegs though grin )


Edited by bobbybob (02/26/12 05:26 PM)
_________________________
Bob
2010 R12000GS
2007 R1200RT (gone)
2008 KLR650 (gone)
2007 F650GS (gone)
2006 FJR1300 (gone)
2005 V-Strom (gone)
2005 E-Glide Classic (gone)

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#762138 - 02/27/12 12:01 AM Re: ESA Shocks! [Re: BerndM]
GoldenK9 Offline
Member

Registered: 08/09/07
Posts: 208
Loc: Forest Ranch, CA. (NorCal)
Thanks Bernd, but I ordered my bike with the ESA option and love the convenience of not having to stop to adjust the suspension no matter how easy it is. I can't imagine having to disable this feature and go backwards in technology.
_________________________
Kenny J. here

'05 R1200RT:Granite Gray Met./Dark Slate Met.
'88 Ducati 750 Paso Ltd:Pearl White/Ducati Red,9900 mi.
'03 Golden Retriever,"Halle":Golden,of course.
'99 Ducati ST2:gone
'85 K100RT:gone

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#762140 - 02/27/12 12:18 AM Re: ESA Shocks! [Re: bobbybob]
GoldenK9 Offline
Member

Registered: 08/09/07
Posts: 208
Loc: Forest Ranch, CA. (NorCal)
Bingo, Bobbybob. You hit the nail right on the head. Preload adjustment works just fine. It's the dampening, or lack of it, that has gone away. I've owned my bike since new, and I know how it used to be. It's not that way now, nor was it the same as a new demo I rode a year or so ago. I know what I like, and what feels right to me. What I have now is NOT what a BMW, or any other bike, for that matter, should be like going down any road, good or bad. confused
_________________________
Kenny J. here

'05 R1200RT:Granite Gray Met./Dark Slate Met.
'88 Ducati 750 Paso Ltd:Pearl White/Ducati Red,9900 mi.
'03 Golden Retriever,"Halle":Golden,of course.
'99 Ducati ST2:gone
'85 K100RT:gone

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#762188 - 02/27/12 08:55 AM Re: ESA Shocks! [Re: GoldenK9]
bobbybob Offline
Member

Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 2356
Loc: Charlotte, NC
Originally Posted By: GoldenK9
Bingo, Bobbybob. You hit the nail right on the head. Preload adjustment works just fine. It's the dampening, or lack of it, that has gone away. I've owned my bike since new, and I know how it used to be. It's not that way now, nor was it the same as a new demo I rode a year or so ago. I know what I like, and what feels right to me. What I have now is NOT what a BMW, or any other bike, for that matter, should be like going down any road, good or bad. confused


Golden, there is a more "cost effective" way of upgrading if you're moving away from ESA. For now, just replace the REAR shock with an Ohlins/etc. and reap about 85% of the benefits of a complete dual replacement--at least as far as your butt will know. I replaced my rear shock first with Ohlins on my 07 RT and then rode it a while before replacing the front. I was starting to wish I hadn't spent the money on a new front shock, it was just THAT much better. But finally I did replace the front also, and it was another notch up, so in the end its good to do them both. But you can "defer" the front replacement for a while and get that "new bike" feeling for 1/2 the cost. Try it! clap
_________________________
Bob
2010 R12000GS
2007 R1200RT (gone)
2008 KLR650 (gone)
2007 F650GS (gone)
2006 FJR1300 (gone)
2005 V-Strom (gone)
2005 E-Glide Classic (gone)

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#762190 - 02/27/12 09:03 AM Re: ESA Shocks! [Re: GoldenK9]
siman00 Offline
Member

Registered: 08/01/07
Posts: 626
Loc: Clayton, NC
Golden, I'm like you; I like the ESA's ease of changing how the bike works, on the fly. I change mine frequently on a ride, depending on where I am at the moment, and my mood at that moment. ESA is a great option, IMO, for making those instantaneous decisions.
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Have fun when you can; life is short...

09 1200 RT Beautiful Black; 01 R 1200 C Phoenix; 05 1200 RT (Sold)

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