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Final Drive Lower Bolt (attachment to swingarm)


Twisties

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i-tZRP4Xd.png

 

So 20, the cover is off. Working on 16 and 19. It doesn't appear that any other parts should have to be removed first? But, this is not going well.

 

We've gotten it to turn, probably 3-4 turns using a breaker bar fitted with a T-55 on 16 and a ratchet fitted with a 24mm socket, with a pipe over the handle for leverage on 19. It broke loose easily enough, in fact that didn't even require the pipe over the ratchet handle. But it never freed up. Now, it's turning by fits and starts, with loud pops as it breaks free. The sudden action is causing the T-55 to come out of place, and damaging the screw. I'm afraid to keep going since I could lose the seating area for the t-55 altogether and need to drill the thing out.

 

 

Edited by Twisties
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Guest Kakugo

Bolt #16 has some very resistant thread locker on it.

I was told by local dealer they use a heat gun at 95-100°C (>200F) for several minutes to liquefy the thread locker: apparently a quick heat application won't do the trick.

 

Hope this helps you a bit.

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The specification is Loctite 243, which is the blue (medium) variety. I did try heating it, but I didn't get it that hot. I'll try some more heat.

 

At this point, I feel the original 16 and 19 need to be replaced. So it's just a matter of getting them out without damaging anything else.

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Guest Kakugo
The specification is Loctite 243, which is the blue (medium) variety. I did try heating it, but I didn't get it that hot. I'll try some more heat.

 

At this point, I feel the original 16 and 19 need to be replaced. So it's just a matter of getting them out without damaging anything else.

 

From previous experience with other BMW bolts using 243, it really takes a lot of heat to melt the thing. That's the first reason why I recently upgraded to a new heat gun.

 

Just out of curiosity, how much do you pay Loctite 243 in the US?

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Probably around $5 for a little tube. Maybe less if you get another brand equivalent/competitive product.

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Success! A line of red thread locker in addition to the heavy application of blue. No corrosion, burring, or other anomalies. Heat, one heat gun and one regular blow dryer combined (operating on separate circuits, of course), did the trick.

 

I'll order replacements since these were so badly stressed.

Edited by Twisties
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Might also be worth your while to clean the remaining threadlock out of the threads in the housing before reinserting - a tap would be best, but a sharp pick or brass toothbrush as an alternative.

 

JayJay

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Might also be worth your while to clean the remaining threadlock out of the threads in the housing before reinserting - a tap would be best, but a sharp pick or brass toothbrush as an alternative.

 

JayJay

 

I ordered both parts new. Thanks!

 

And thanks to everyone that helped throughout this saga.

Edited by Twisties
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  • 1 year later...

Hey there, I wonder if someone could elaborate on something. I thought I was developing play in my final drive for a few years. I measured the rear wheel run out and it was within spec, but seemed a lot to me. When I grab the rear wheel at the 2 and 7 o'clock positions, I feel play, but was confused why I never felt it at the 3 and 9 o'clock positions. I just figured out the play is not in the final drive, but in that lower pivot assembly you guys are talking about. I wonder if #2,17,5,and or 19 are worn. (FYI, Just had my rear flange done, and was checking that play like I do so often to make sure it wasn't any worse after the job and it's not, it is about the same). SO, is it normal to have play in that pivot assembly? Or is something definitely worn? Is this common? Going on a LONG trip in 2 weeks (2500 miles) and don't want any problems.

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Hey there, I wonder if someone could elaborate on something. I thought I was developing play in my final drive for a few years. I measured the rear wheel run out and it was within spec, but seemed a lot to me. When I grab the rear wheel at the 2 and 7 o'clock positions, I feel play, but was confused why I never felt it at the 3 and 9 o'clock positions. I just figured out the play is not in the final drive, but in that lower pivot assembly you guys are talking about. I wonder if #2,17,5,and or 19 are worn. (FYI, Just had my rear flange done, and was checking that play like I do so often to make sure it wasn't any worse after the job and it's not, it is about the same). SO, is it normal to have play in that pivot assembly? Or is something definitely worn? Is this common? Going on a LONG trip in 2 weeks (2500 miles) and don't want any problems.

 

Morning Ed

 

Rear wheel run-out is a separate operation & has nothing to do with rear wheel lateral movement or pivot bearing play (run-out usually checks for a bent wheel)

 

I presume that your are measuring rear wheel lateral movement when you say run-out,--correct????

 

How much total wheel movement are you seeing at the wheel rim? (it doesn't take much pivot area movement to translate into noticeable movement at the wheel rim)

 

As for number 2,17,5,19 being worn & causing your 2/7 felt lateral movement, that is very possible. You could have some wear in the needle bearing or the angular roller bearing or on either or both pivot pins.

 

You might be able to define the location (side) of m-o-s-t of the movement by getting some help to move the wheel as you feel for movement on both sides of the pivot area. More than likely one side will have more movement than the other.

 

You can also take the entire pivot assembly apart then look for excessive play between the pivot pins & bearings but once you remove the parts it is difficult to load them enough to really tell much unless you find a trashed bearing or obvious wear on a pivot pin.

 

If you just have some normal parts wear but the bearings still have grease in them & no obvious signs of corrosion or bearing damage then they will probably run your entire trip without issue. BUT- without removing & inspecting you just never know what you will find (especially if dirty water migrated into the bearings & corroded the bearing or pivot surfaces.

 

The pivot assembly can sometimes be a pain to get apart but for peace-of-mind on your trip it would probably be a good idea to at least take it apart & inspect the parts & re-grease the needle bearing

 

If you can find one side that has the most wear (most movement) then probably (at least) replace the bearing & pivot pin on that side.

 

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Hey Dirtrider, I knew you would hit this up, THANKS. So, I thought it was the Final drive creating the LATERAL MOVEMENT (not run out) but like I said, was always baffled why it was in one direction and not the other. So, last time I checked, it was about .020" lateral movement at the wheel, feels like it may have gotten a tad more, but doubt it's more than .025". So, I think the movement is mostly on the inboard side, but I just ordered all those parts today, #s 19,5,4,3,2,18,17,16. Due to time constraints for the trip, I want all those in my hand for when I take it apart Saturday. Anything beside the heating up that I need to know? Again, I am a seasoned auto tech, so it looks somewhat straight forward and something I can handle. I assume I will have to slap hammer or tap out the needle bearing, probably snugged in there, and carefully tap new one in with a hammer and a puck, or C-clamp. Sound about right?

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last time I checked, it was about .020" lateral movement at the wheel, feels like it may have gotten a tad more, but doubt it's more than .025". So, I think the movement is mostly on the inboard side, but I just ordered all those parts today, #s 19,5,4,3,2,18,17,16. Due to time constraints for the trip, I want all those in my hand for when I take it apart Saturday. Anything beside the heating up that I need to know? Again, I am a seasoned auto tech, so it looks somewhat straight forward and something I can handle. I assume I will have to slap hammer or tap out the needle bearing, probably snugged in there, and carefully tap new one in with a hammer and a puck, or C-clamp. Sound about right?

 

Evening Ed

 

The BMW manual gives you 1mm (.039") rear wheel movement measured at the rim (cold) as OK. But that is mainly a bearing play measurement (they don't have a pivot bearing area spec)

 

You will probably need to heat the bolt/pivot to get it out as it is LocTited in.

 

As far as removing/replacing the needle bearing?--I have only done 1 needle bearing & it was kind of a pain to get out due to the thin rim. New one going back in wasn't a problem but I made a precision fit needle bearing driver on my lathe so it tapped right in with just a bit of heat on the metal around the bearing bore. (make sure there is plenty of grease in the needle bearing before final assembly (the one I did didn't have much grease in it)

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So it's apart. Tried to loosen the bolt without heat for the hell of it, and it came right out. Very minor trace of blue/locktite. Strange. I bought this bike with 2k on it from the original owner an I doubt he ever had it apart. Anywho, 19 fits snug into 5, barely any looseness. No wear seen on 19, and 5 is in good condition, not loose, feels like it is still full of grease with a nice smooth resistance in it like I would expect from a sealed bearing. 17 is a little loose in the #2 needle bearing, about what I was seeing when I rocked the wheel, but don't really see any wear. There really wasn't any grease left in the bearing, so maybe that, along with some very minor wear that can't be seen in the needle bearing is causing the play. Going to replace the needle bearing and #17 and hopefully my play will be gone. Looking at the picture, and I don't remember seeing #18. Have to check that. Maybe it fell out and I didn't see it. Looks like a seal. If that is gone, maybe that's why it dried up?? Just double checking, the larger diameter part of #4 rests on the sealed bearing right? (there is a witness mark on #4 that matches the inner race of the bearing so I am 99% sure that is right, it fell out of my hand before I could make a note of which way it sat in there). Should have the parts tomorrow to put it back together. Will let yal know how I do.

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Thanks Dirtrider are you getting paid for this?? LOL! Still not so clear on the spacer, I think the way I have it makes sense, the O-ring is closest to the bearing. So #5 is a slip ring, maybe it's stuck to #4 and I didn't see it. So, when it talks about doing both sides together, does that mean I should replace everything? (I ordered both bearings and everything related) Was going to replace everything except the outboard bearing cause it felt good.

Don't want to change the subject, but, I have a BMW repair manual on DVD, but I don't understand why I can't find the details on this stuff. The properties/name of the DVD is RepROM_K2X. I don't remember where I got it. When I put the DVD in my drive, I click on the RepRom.exe and the repair manual opens. On the top it's labeled RepROM R 1200 RT (USA) (1st Edition, 01/2005) when I open the rear wheel drive tab, there are sub tabs. When I click on final drive attachment, the repair manual box is grayed out. I wonder if I got screwed buying an "early" disc that has limited info on it?

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Didn't look very closely yet, but also wondering if I could press the bearings out either way? I will look close for any lips indicating they could only come out in one direction.

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Didn't look very closely yet, but also wondering if I could press the bearings out either way? I will look close for any lips indicating they could only come out in one direction.

 

Evening Ed

 

My 05 RepRom is grayed out for housing final drive attachment also. Later RepRoms show the final drive attachment procedure.

 

On replacing your needle bearing--be sure to heat the housing to about 175° before driving that bearing out. (book shows driving out towards inside)

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Update. Job done. FYI, #18 seal was not there when I took it apart. When installed, it does help to hold the whole deal together better. I pressed the needle bearing out toward the inside with a c clamp and a socket on the inside for it to go into, and a socket on the outside to press it through, after heat gunning it to about 150 degrees, came right out. Took many measurements of the depth of the bearing before pressing it out, so as to install the new one to the right depth. Lots to think about there. FYI, the needle bearing does look different on one side (needles closer to the edge than on the other side, so I made sure to install the new one the same way. Went right in with the c clamp (also heated the FD to aid installation) I left the angular bearing alone. It is fine. All together, feels much tighter, but there is still a hair of play. Not worried about it. It is as tight and smooth as it will ever be. I wonder if any one else has this play and doesn't know what it is, or thinks it's in the final drive, but actually is in the pivot bearings area. Anywho, Skyline drive/Blueridge parkway, here I come!!!

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