BMWSportTouring BMWST DB
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 6 of 8 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8
#996641 - 09/11/17 06:52 PM Re: The Harley State [Re: Dennis Andress]  
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 3,952
marcopolo Offline
Member
marcopolo  Offline
Member

Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 3,952
Alexandria, VA/Ottawa, Canada
I believe we have a generation which is less interested in owning vehicles, but I don't see how not owning a vehicle, be it a car, or a motorcycle, has anything to do with "personal freedom". Maybe I don't understand what the point was.

Last edited by marcopolo; 09/11/17 07:17 PM.

Mark
2015 R 1200 GS Adventure
#996654 - 09/11/17 10:19 PM Re: The Harley State [Re: Lone_RT_rider]  
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,592
FlyingFinn Offline
Member
FlyingFinn  Offline
Member

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 1,592
CA
Originally Posted By: Lone_RT_rider

I think we finally have a generation that cares less about it's personal freedom than the previous one.


I don't think that's the case at all. Their definition and perception of freedom is just different than yours/ours.

Their freedom is not to have a car payment, not to have to struggle with parking, not to have to worry about car maintenance, freedom to travel, party, work etc. withput ever having to worry where is MY car, how to get back home etc.
Owning and having to "drag along" your own car is to them like dead weight that makes them less agile. Less free.

They just look at things differently, with focus on doing things instead of owning things.

And "they" in the context of this reply = twenty something young adults who live & work in bigger cities.

#996838 - 09/14/17 02:24 AM Re: The Harley State [Re: FlyingFinn]  
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,002
Paul De Offline
Member
Paul De  Offline
Member

Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,002
Milwaukee Wisconsin, USA
Originally Posted By: FlyingFinn
Originally Posted By: Lone_RT_rider

I think we finally have a generation that cares less about it's personal freedom than the previous one.


I don't think that's the case at all. Their definition and perception of freedom is just different than yours/ours.

Their freedom is not to have a car payment, not to have to struggle with parking, not to have to worry about car maintenance, freedom to travel, party, work etc. withput ever having to worry where is MY car, how to get back home etc.
Owning and having to "drag along" your own car is to them like dead weight that makes them less agile. Less free.

They just look at things differently, with focus on doing things instead of owning things.

And "they" in the context of this reply = twenty something young adults who live & work in bigger cities.


Going far from the original topic but what you describe is nothing new, each generation letting their freedom flag fly and all...but in the end all become invested in something. Soon enough, there is something to loose and they become the establishment. So, then how does an established company capture the freedom of those who have willingly forgone foot loose and fancy free for a more rooted life. So maybe sell cheap time shares and entice those who would consider owning their own with he freedom to fit that ride in between their gigs, kids and other commitments. OK now I'm depressed!


If the good old days were so damn good, why did we bother to invent modern times?

Most missed bike: Bultaco Sherpa T 326
#996845 - 09/14/17 09:47 AM Re: The Harley State [Re: Paul De]  
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 683
CommuterChris Offline
Member
CommuterChris  Offline
Member

Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 683
Dallas, Georgia
Originally Posted By: Paul De
[quote=FlyingFinn]
Going far from the original topic but what you describe is nothing new, each generation letting their freedom flag fly and all...but in the end all become invested in something. Soon enough, there is something to loose and they become the establishment. So, then how does an established company capture the freedom of those who have willingly forgone foot loose and fancy free for a more rooted life. So maybe sell cheap time shares and entice those who would consider owning their own with he freedom to fit that ride in between their gigs, kids and other commitments. OK now I'm depressed!


I think the quote is
If You Are Not a Liberal at 25, You Have No Heart. If You Are Not a Conservative at 35 You Have No Brain

#997063 - 09/16/17 04:57 PM Re: The Harley State [Re: BamaRider]  
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 54
rodantking Offline
Member
rodantking  Offline
Member

Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 54
I think you guys are thinking way to global on this. Yes the world is changing. Daily commuter cars are about to be turn upside down. I agree that the average college kid isn't thinking about a harley right now and is thinking about virtual reality. That said, I don't think motorcycles are in any long term trouble. There will be a revolt against the mundane when they wake up one day and realize they are wasting their lives on xbox and crave danger and adrenaline in their lives. Owning a commuter car in a big city may become a rare thing very soon, but that doesn't necessarily apply to recreation. Sports car that you, not a computer, can drive and motorcycles without dumb stuff like dual clutches (Honda are you listening?) will still find there place. I believe the next nostalgia market will be analog.

Harley is double downing killing v rod. Maybe they're right. I say good luck with that, but its hard to say what it might look like. Harley needs to stop thing entry level priced bikes are going to rescue them and start thinking about what that broke 25 year old will want when he gets money. Maybe they have and feel that its a harley, but having more than one line in the water right now couldn't hurt. I think out of Vrod and Buell, The Buell had more promise. They finally let eric go out and get a real motor and killed the whole line a year later. The v rod line really is very close to harley and really could be rebirthed under the harley name if they wanted. I think is they had stayed with buell a few more years they would have started seeing promise if they continued on the mindset of the 1090. Then they would have time to learn how to build their own motor and bring back the America thyme under the Harley network. Now who would trust Harley if they did start a new line that they weren't going to leave them high and dry will no dealer or parts support. I haven't heard if they are killing those two thing with vrod, but they did with Buell.
One other poster did mention the dealer network was part of the problem. I would agree but for different reason. How many guys on the sales floor knew much of anything about the buell and probably looked down on it.

#997075 - 09/16/17 09:54 PM Re: The Harley State [Re: rodantking]  
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,722
realshelby Offline
Member
realshelby  Offline
Member

Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,722
Houston, Tx
Originally Posted By: rodantking

One other poster did mention the dealer network was part of the problem. I would agree but for different reason. How many guys on the sales floor knew much of anything about the buell and probably looked down on it.


The Harley Davidson dealer network is the best in the business. As long as you own or want to buy a HARLEY. Buells and V Rods are not HARLEYS. I went to two dealers in Houston and looked at a Buell for over 1/2 hour. No one even spoke to me. So it isn't just not knowing product, it is not wanting to sell the product. That will KILL any attempt to stray beyond the beaten path with the brand. Harley sells lifestyle. Not too interested in things that interest a typical BMW owner for instance ( probably the two most opposite attitudes ).

#997093 - 09/17/17 12:01 AM Re: The Harley State [Re: BamaRider]  
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 36
slipknot Offline
Newer Member
slipknot  Offline
Newer Member

Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 36
I've seen children of friends not being interested in learning to drive until they exited college and entered reality. Now they own cars. As for the car share, that will work for those that can't afford their own or only need one once or twice a month. People like stuff and they want their own stuff. And people that do not own things tend to abuse things they rent.

#997466 - 09/21/17 01:23 AM Re: The Harley State [Re: TEWKS]  
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,655
beemerboy Offline
RallyMaster UnXI, Salida, CO
beemerboy  Offline
RallyMaster UnXI, Salida, CO
Member

Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,655
Colorado Springs, CO
Originally Posted By: TEWKS
whistle



Pat


That is freakin' GORGEOUS!


Regards,
Randy
'02 R1150RT
'05 Ducati ST3
'06 K1200S
#997746 - 09/25/17 08:25 PM Re: The Harley State [Re: BamaRider]  
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,030
lkchris Offline
Member
lkchris  Offline
Member

Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,030
NM USA
So, I'm 70 and my parents were 43/40 when I was born and they were youngest children ... I've been around lots of old people.

So maybe the difference between now and the 1950s is that a greater percentage of us haven't been smokers and maybe we actually are pretty healthy and get some exercise and eat well. That maybe wasn't the case in the 1950s ...

... and of course nostalgia for the 1950s and Harley Davidson go hand in hand.

As an aging Baby Boomer it's clear to me the trend is more and more away from nostalgia, and the next generations don't care much about me/us. They might be a bit more do-gooders too, i.e. maybe less interested in any bad boy image. No cigarette packs rolled up in t-shirt sleeves for them. Fewer beer bellies, too.

Yeah, I think HD is in trouble.

They've been an embarrassment to American engineering since the '60s in any event.



PS: owning/riding a motorcycle makes no one an expert on "freedom." That's got nothing to do with the discussion nor with motorcycling.

Last edited by lkchris; 09/25/17 08:28 PM.

Kent Christensen
Albuquerque
'12 R1200RT, '02 R1100S, '84 R80G/S
#997768 - 09/25/17 11:46 PM Re: The Harley State [Re: lkchris]  
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 5,870
OoPEZoO Offline
Member
OoPEZoO  Offline
Member

Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 5,870
Amish Country, PA
I had to stop in the local HD dealership this afternoon to pick up some new exhaust gaskets for my Buell. This stopped me in my tracks....the new Fat Bob



I think they did a really awesome job designing it. I love it and think it looks even better in person. Only problem I had with it is I hate the feet out in front cruiser ergos. That and the $19k+ price tag.....on something that is basically just a motor, seat, and tires. On the bright side, I was immediately offered a test ride just by just eyeballing it for a few seconds. I would have taken them up on it if I wasn't dressed in business casual. I got looked at kinda weird when I mentioned I didn't have my gear with me for a test ride.


-Keith (Yup, thats me...and my rubber chicken)

Making the world a better place, one rubber chicken at a time!

'98 Buell S1 Lightning
'06 R1200GS
'86 Honda CB125
'00 R1100RT (parting out, PM me)
Page 6 of 8 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0
Page Time: 0.009s Queries: 14 (0.003s) Memory: 2.8162 MB (Peak: 3.0058 MB) Zlib enabled. Server Time: 2017-11-24 02:03:08 UTC