When and Where

[Dennis Andress]

The 2025 UnRally will be held in Lee Vining, California. While Lee Vining is a busy little place near the eastern entrance to Yosemite Natl. Park, it is also somewhat remote. There are several hotels and restaurants, but there is not a lodge or resort to be seen, and likewise probably not a restaurant that'll feed a large group. Which means we'll have to find our own way - the Un Un as someone said.

 

This whole idea came about when Carl Wiliams, Larry Bump, and I spent a couple of nights in Lee Vining after Fall Torrey in 2023. We stayed in a place called Murphey's Motel - nice people, 3rd generation owners. I talked with them about special rates for an event at their hotel. They wouldn't do it. But, they'll take reservations a year or more in advance, and were perfectly happy with the thought of us reserving many (or a few) of their 42 rooms months in advance. This year, 2024, their summertime rates are in effect until around Sept. 10th, we were there late in the month and paid around $90 a night.

 

Why September? Because it's not as hot, and all the tourists with yipping kids go away after Labor Day, and Yosemite won't be as horribly crowded, and should be beautiful. (And it often starts snowing the first week of October.)

 

We need to think about, discuss, and pick dates. Torry in Sept. 2025 will be on the 26, 27, and 28, which leaves all the dates from when the hotel rates drop (which we don't know yet) and say the 24th. If you are even a little bit interested in going, what are your thoughts about dates?

 

 

[Dennis Andress]

Weather Lee Vining is at 6,777 ft. Low temperatures in August are in the 40's with highs in the 70's. Up in Yosemite, Tuolumne Meadows at 8600 ft has lows in the 30's and highs in the 70's. That pattern shouldn't change until October. Mornings warm up quickly and we should be able to ride around 8:30, but bring enough warm clothes to deal with cold nights.

[Rob Nowell]

I like the idea of the later calendar.  This would be my first Un.

[Dennis Andress]

If you're inclined for a more private place to stay the El Mono Motel looked pretty good. The coffee shop on the front gets pretty busy in the mornings...

https://elmonomotel.com/

[hunter41]

Definitely interested.  I like September and more like the 12th vs 19th.  Would be my first Un, and hopefully not my first BMWST event!

[randy]

I am not going to make this, my wife has dictated our 2025 vacation plans.  2025 will be her second full year of retirement and she wants to do something as a family but probably in Washington DC at the monuments and museums. 

 

These would be my comments

Yes all the family's will be gone, but that has another side to the coin, any member that is a teacher, or principle, or even has kids in school is most likely out.
 

Otherwise, September is as good as any other month.  I am surprised that the Tues-Friday after Labor Day is not when the rates go down.

 

I would have probably preferred Sept 2 - 19 vs say Sept 22-Oct 3

The east coast Fall rally will (most likely) be Sept 24-28 so keep that in mind

[Dennis Andress]

3 hours ago, randy said:

I am not going to make this, my wife has dictated our 2025 vacation plans.  2025 will be her second full year of retirement and she wants to do something as a family but probably in Washington DC at the monuments and museums. 

 

These would be my comments

Yes all the family's will be gone, but that has another side to the coin, any member that is a teacher, or principle, or even has kids in school is most likely out.
 

Otherwise, September is as good as any other month.  I am surprised that the Tues-Friday after Labor Day is not when the rates go down.

 

I would have probably preferred Sept 2 - 19 vs say Sept 22-Oct 3

The east coast Fall rally will (most likely) be Sept 24-28 so keep that in mind

 

I was looking forward to meeting you again. Would negotiation between going to D.C. or renting a Boxster to tour Yosemite be possible?

 

Murphey's Motel told me that October is their busiest month, bringing hordes of wanabe photographers, and a few pros who teach how to take pictures of falling leaves.

 

I know that some will not be able to take time off in September, and that most on the east will have to decide between the UN and FART...  But, the last couple of weeks of September should be noticeably cooler, so it's worth a try.

 

[Twisties]

I'd say either the week of Sep 29th, or start it the 19th or 20th and encompass the weekend, ending on the 24th so folk can get to Torrey.  9 hours from Torrey to Lee Vining.  Easy peasy, or take two days to make it fun and scenic.

 

In any event, my vote would be to make it right before or right after Torrey so people can catch both in a single outing.  

[Twisties]

Also, I think you ought to make this a featured post.

[szurszewski]

Right before Torrey would be good dates for me - but I don't think I'd go to both, I just like end of September. I like the idea of not hot, and it's actually easier for me to do something like this during the school year when Laura and Jeremiah are busy with school stuff and don't much care or notice what I'm doing. (That's mostly true in the summer too - I mean, they're not busy with school stuff - the other thing.) While I can technically take my vacation time whenever I like, it's easier to do in certain parts of the year - late September is a sweet spot in "they don't really need me at work" and "it's still nice enough to ride in the PNW". The last couple of years I've spent a week or so in late September basing out of a rental in central Oregon, but I've had the house to myself both years because apparently I'm just not that popular. ;)

 

 

 

 

[mbelectric]

Anytime between the 15th and the 23….

 

 UN , Torrey, Fart all within two weeks of each other. Discuss.

[Twisties]

11 hours ago, mbelectric said:

Anytime between the 15th and the 23….

 

 UN , Torrey, Fart all within two weeks of each other. Discuss.

As I'm learning, although nominally FART is a weekend event, a few people get there as much as a week ahead, and most are there by Wednesday night.  Even with Torrey and FART offset a week (as they are this year due to an error), it's a tough ride to make them mesh up.  With Torrey and FART typically the same weekend as they are normally, it's an either or thing.  That said, FART is getting the kind of attendance Torrey used to....  go figure.

 

In any event, you have a point that putting the UN just before or just after Torrey would make it incompatible with FART... if FART is at it's typical time.  It's just too far to go in a few days.  If someone wanted to have the UN in this time frame and not impact FART, I think FART would have to move a week or two one way or the other. @Indy Dave ?

 

All that said, I am concerned about Lee Vining having sufficient facilities for an UN.  

[mbelectric]

Agreed on the Lee Vining location having sufficient facilities…And just so everyone knows, the weekend influx into the town doesn’t let up until after Tioga Pass closes. So I would probably stay away from weekend booking there. 

[Indy Dave]

Speaking for The Art's, we typically have 90% of participants arriving on Wednesday night. It used to be that we called those arriving on Thursdays 'Early Birds'.... But as the event has evolved, it's primarily a Wednesday to Sunday event, but folks know they're free to arrive on any day. Having said that, there has been a trend lately of folks arriving earlier in the week, as early as the Saturday or Sunday prior to. Some of that is due to the generosity of Boxflyer extending his stay so that more folks can get their bikes meticulously serviced.

 

The dates that START and FART fall on are not random, they were chosen to take advantage of off peak travel and of peak hotel rates.

[Bernie]

[roadscholar]

6 hours ago, Twisties said:

Even with Torrey and FART offset a week (as they are this year due to an error), it's a tough ride to make them mesh up.  With Torrey and FART typically the same weekend as they are normally, it's an either or thing.

 

I know there are a few road warriors but as the majority of BMWST'ers age I think there's less desire to cross the great expanse than even 10 years ago. 

 

6 hours ago, Twisties said:

if FART is at it's typical time.  It's just too far to go in a few days.  If someone wanted to have the UN in this time frame and not impact FART, I think FART would have to move a week or two one way or the other. @Indy Dave ?

 

It's not up to FART to move it's date, it's been long established as being the last weekend before motel rates increase for leaf season, it was Ken's mission long ago and maybe Baker's before that. 

 

6 hours ago, Twisties said:

That said, FART is getting the kind of attendance Torrey used to....  go figure.

 

For a couple of reasons, one it has the advantage of being in a more concentrated/populous region but it also moves to different locations and people like the variety of riding different roads unlike the repetition at Torrey. Also, and this is subjective, but it seems riders like having more structure with regard to organized meals, rides, and routes, plus taking advantage of the tech provided by Boxflyer.

 

As far as I can tell, moving the Unrally from East to West to central each year is patterned after the MOA rally, the only problem is they have a much larger member pool to choose from so it has little effect on attendance, combine that with dwindling numbers in motorcycling, general malaise/apathy, and again, aging creates less attendance for the big distance venues. 

 

If I were king (and no I don't want to be : ) although have been an event organizer for 20+ years) I'd put the Unrally in the (so-called) center every year but in different locations to vary the riding. Anywhere up and down the Continental Divide or not too far away for a couple reasons, one altitude, which means it can be held mid Summer for nice temperatures and two is more accessible to more people, East coasters are more likely to make the trek, plus it wouldn't conflict with the two or three big regional events. I can think of plenty of small towns in NM, CO, WY, SD, or even Montana that could likely work, not to mention ones that have been used in the past. Maybe like Chama, Pagosa Springs, Maysville, Buena Vista, Leadville, Eagle/Avon, Kremmling, and I'm sure others beyond the ones I'm familiar with, just some food for thought. 

 

 

[Dennis Andress]

The last couple of years have proven that structure, organized meals, and published rides make people happy. Hat's off to Indy Dave and the Bumbling Backroad crew for doing it time, after time, after time. MikeB60 and DyAnn too.

 

Twenty plus years ago Gunison #1 was our first national event. Being fledglings we didn't have any structure (what organization raised its head was promptly squashed), just a desire to explore places we'd never seen, with people we'd only recently met (in person). Afterwards there was talk of how much more fun it was than a stodgy MOA rally, and how we should do it every year. I think it was Gleno who came up with the name UN Rally - because it would have less structure (none) than the rallys held by other groups of the day. The East, West, Central rotation came about when someone said "I live in the east and would like to show ya'll some of my roads." (or something like that). Ah, those were good times....

 

It's pleasing the ARTS can attract the number of people they do twice a year. But, doing it a third time isn't working. At Lee Vining I'd like to try more spontaneity and less structure. If you can deal with that, and the thought of long days criss crossing the Sierra Nevada is appealing, then I welcome you to come join us.

[Dennis Andress]

20 hours ago, mbelectric said:

Anytime between the 15th and the 23….

 

 UN , Torrey, Fart all within two weeks of each other. Discuss.

I knew going in that holding the UN in September would conflict with FART. I figured the east coast people who wanted to ride Yosemite bad enough to cross the country would skip a FART to do it. (Sorry guys and gals)  Next year's Fall Torrey will be our 50th, so most of the regular crowd will make a big effort to be there. Holding the UN in late September is in our best interests. As Josh said above, it is a sweat spot.

 

If we are there until the 24th of September then we will also be there for the previous weekend. I need to get back to Lee Vining and touch base with Murphy's Motel, but I believe that making reservations way in advance will ease the affects of the weekend crowd.

 

[Motorhead1977]

[marcopolo]

I attended my first UnRally in 2006, in Gunnison.  A lot has changed since then.  As time has marched on, I am much less inclined to cross the  continent for several days riding, no matter how nice the area (and I've been to Lee Vining).  All that to say, I don't think the prospective dates for the UnRally will be a major point of interest to the "eastern" crowd.  I also suspect that attendance at FART 2025 will pretty much be what it's been the last number of years. As for level of organization, I think there's a sweet spot, and I think the ARTs have hit it, or close to it.  That said, I think there'll be noticeable interest in UnRally 2025, for those closer to the venue.

[RTinNC]

It seems as though the events will remain regional with ARTs being an east coast event and the UN a west coast event.  There will always be a few who cross the country to attend one or the other but for the most part the ARTs have built quite a strong following with the attendees being quite friendly.  The spring and fall ARTs are a time to visit with and ride with your “ART friends”.  
 

In addition the ARTs have worked to be very inviting and welcoming to new attendees.  As Mark noted the ARTs have made the event just organized enough.  I’ve head friends comment that they attended the MOA getaway weekend events and they much prefer the ARTs. 

[Motorhead1977]

While I would truly like to attend an UN in California or thereabouts, the trip out and back would require about 8 days total (4 x approx 700 miles/day each way) making the whole excursion expand out to about 3 weeks.  Since neither of us are retired and I'm self employed that's a big consideration.  Eureka Springs was about the outside limit on distance for this easterner,  Also, as I am getting older I'm also not so inclined to crisscross the continent as I once was on something like my RS (or even a Goldwing anymore).  I'll look for the pictures and stories and hope that the next UN that comes East will happen before I have to limit myself to 4 wheels.

[Indy Dave]

Speaking for myself as a fellow member of the BMWST community, I offer this (rambling?) observation:

 

1) I have never felt that the popularity of an event or events reflected the vitality of BMWST. I was a fairly active poster for 8-10 years before I first attended an event. And even that wouldn't have happened had someone not reached out to me and INVITED me! The overwhelming majority of folks here have never been to a BMWST event - and I think that's fine. But.. we can also invite and encourage folks to attend. For most, I think it's a case of "not knowing what you don't know". Had I known what I was missing out on in the beggining, I would have been coming to events from the get-go!

 

Now speaking for myself and as a member of the BBR team that organizes The Art's:

 

2) For old timers  and others who've been to 3 or more events, it can be easy to lose sight of what it was like to attend your first event - especially if you don't know anyone in person. We tend to spend a lot of our time with the friends we've made that we only see at these events. This can make it difficult for first timers to break-in to the group or meet folks. Again - for me personally - at these events I look forward to seeing friends from GA, FL, RI, TN, LA and Canada. So it can be difficult to make time to engage and welcome others unless I'm intentional about it. This is the same challenge new folks face when trying to find others to ride with. We have been lucky that many in our group are gracious enough to welcome new folks into their ride group. Let's face it - if one lives in the... say flat-lands of Indiana  - the roads offered at The Art's are a sight for sore eyes and mothballed machines. It can be hard to welcome a new rider into an established ride group and compromise one of the few great riding days you have all year.

 

This is why @Bernie (and now his team) developed the "First Timers Ride'. So that people who were attending their first or second event could ride with others who were also new attenders, and get to know some veteran members and also other newbies, and they could begin to build their own ride groups. The first timers ride is under development and is being refined and improved.

 

But.. When the first timer ride was offered - the howling and noise from the traditionalists !   Same thing when Boxflyer first arrived.

Too organized!

Blasphemy!     

 

The first optional Thursday night pizza night came about the night before it actually happened - @Endobob  - BBR Member Emeritus - suggested it at the hotel as we visited and we just winged it! Bob gave me his CC number (he really did!) and I ordered pizza and we waited to see who would show up. We then had to order more pizza to meet the response!

 

This has never been about what we were - it's about who we are, and how can we make it easier for new folks to feel welcome and at home and get to know others in the group. It's not easy to break into a group of folks who've been coming to these events for years - including a surprising number who've been coming for 21 years! A LOT has changed over the years- and if you're learning that now for the first time, you're not paying attention.   There are motorcycle events pretty much every weekend, folks have a lot of choices! If you're like me, and I know I am, you've changed a lot in the last 20 years. Consider that for a minute. Consider the amount and depth of changes in your bikes, your lifestyle and your aches and pains! 

 

No changes are permanent

But change is!

       "Tom Sawyer" - Rush

 

The changes that have come about over the years have never had the goal of being "more organized" or being less like the MOA or RA Rallies. They have come about by working together and listening to others and trying to serve the needs of the group. And while it sounds simple - it isn't. Add in trying to work with me, and it's damn near impossible.  

 

The easiest thing to do for us is to keep doing things the way they have always been done. I'm guilty of often telling myself that it's good enough to not post a schedule or to wait to do something, because MOST of the folks already know what to expect (which is not much! haha). Enter The BBR's - this team of both old and newer members bring great insight and a can-do attitude geared toward making these events better and more welcoming, and calling me on the pavement (and leaving me there) for my shortsightedness (and other things). Providing a framework for a given event, with options for attenders to avail themselves of is common sense nowadays. It's what many folks expect, and it's what new folks need.

 

Things change.

 

 

[Indy Dave]

I also wanted to say that, by definition - holding events on either of the coasts or in the most Northern or Southern regions, will greatly restrict attendance. The organizers realize this I'm sure. Events are not compulsory. Coming from the West Coast to an East Coast event takes commitment and time and money. And vice-versa. Most any of us are not going to make that trip directly on the super-slab. So you're looking at a 3 week commitment minimal. It's worked out for me once to line up the stars and make a West Coast UN. And I knew at the time it would be a long time before I could do it again - if ever!

 

On the flip side - these areas can bring in folks who are close and that other events have been too far away for.

[Bernie]

I believe that BMWST.com really needs more events in the western part of the country. How and where these events are or when is up to the members in that area. 

Could they be west coast 'ART's? Maybe they should be named RMRT's? (Rocky Mountain Riding Tours?). Or SRT's (Sierra Riding Tour?).

Over the last few years DART has been started and is turning into a great event, drawing riders from near and far.

I think the same should be able to be started somewhere west of the Rockies. I know there are lots of BMWST.com members out on that side of the country.

Someone will just have to take the bull by the horns and get it going.

The 'ART's didn't start with a big selection of routes or group dinners etc. Those things developed as more and more guys showed up and wanted to explore the area or enjoy dinner with the other members. 

 

[Skywagon]

If you are an organizer of any of the event...my hats off to you for all the work you put into the events.

 

Reading all of Indy daves's notes above...let me share some thoughts and ideas

 

I attended my first event this year in Arkansas.  Bernie had developed some spectacular events and the two evening dinners were great...thanks to whomever organized that.  Bernie sent them out in advance and advised what versions of software you needed.  This was key and greatly appreciated.

 

I felt a bit out of place when I got there.  I didn't know anyone, didn't know anyone to ride with, almost turned around and went home - seriously.  Improvement....there is always a leader of a group.  Have a leader meeting each morning or evening that is open for all to attend and buddy up with some group so that newcomers like me have someone to ride with.

 

Many of us don't own trailers so must ride to the events.  Anything more than a 9-10 hour ride will eliminate a lot of folks...including me.  I don't want to own a trailer.  If someone gave me a new one, I would need to give it back as no room for it.

 

I was really fortunate to meet Randy (quite by luck in the parking lot) and Andy.  They were nice enough to invite me on their rides and a couple of nights of dinner.  Had I not met Randy, I most likely would have returned home the next day.  It is important...( I know repeating myself) to have the leaders greet and invite newcomers on their routes.

 

 

 

 

 

[Bluenoser]

Having only been to California once (1981) when I rode down the coast and into Mexico, I don't know where the good riding is there other than if there are hills it should be good.  

 

If there was an event held in January or February in an area where the weather could be expected to be warm and where the riding was good, I would be very tempted to travel south from Canada to attend.  Does such a place exist? I know the mountain passes get too cold in the winter. 

 

The west coast is much too far to go for me in September when the weather is good enough for riding closer to home.

[roadscholar]

Maybe I'll start a new event something like I mentioned above in small towns along the Continental Divide and call it SMART, Simple Middle America Riding Tour. Nah just kidding.  

 

Regarding structure/organization in events, you really don't need it for 25-35 people but you do for 125, otherwise you're just herding cats.

[Hosstage]

[John Ranalletta]

Re: UnRally/25, does it make sense to pin a poll to get an indication of interest, say, "0=no chance" and "5=In"?  Members wouldn't be asked which event they prefer or even a reason.  Seems it could give the event organizer(s) a clue to participation.

[Motorhead1977]

16 minutes ago, John Ranalletta said:

Re: UnRally/25, does it make sense to pin a poll to get an indication of interest, say, "0=no chance" and "5=In"?  Members wouldn't be asked which event they prefer or even a reason.  Seems it could give the event organizer(s) a clue to participation.

John, It would be difficult to say "0" or "5" without some indication of the general location.  I will say that our attendance at the UN'22 in WV led to our consistent attendance at the ARTs.

[John Ranalletta]

9 minutes ago, Motorhead1977 said:

John, It would be difficult to say "0" or "5" without some indication of the general location.  I will say that our attendance at the UN'22 in WV led to our consistent attendance at the ARTs.

The location is Lee Vining, CA as I understand it.

[Motorhead1977]

Ooops. brain cramp.  For some reason I thinking the Lee Vining CA was 2024 but that was the Ozarks and it's here and gone.  Doh!  As Emily Latella used to say on SNL...."Never mind"

[Dennis Andress]

6 hours ago, Indy Dave said:

2) For old timers  and others who've been to 3 or more events, it can be easy to lose sight of what it was like to attend your first event - especially if you don't know anyone in person. 

I got up early one cold winter morning and hustled the 250 or so miles to Death Valley. I made it to Furnace Creek around 8:00 am, and found a group of people getting ready to ride. Jamie pulled up next to me and said: "Who are you?" I answer "Dennis." "Do you want to ride with us?"  "Yes"

 

 

5 hours ago, Bernie said:

I believe that BMWST.com really needs more events in the western part of the country.

 

There are several - Death Valley, Weaverville, North Meets South, Ramona Days, and now Atascadero (maybe).

 

 

On 9/8/2024 at 1:49 PM, Indy Dave said:

The dates that START and FART fall on are not random, they were chosen to take advantage of off peak travel and of peak hotel rates.

Being stuck in the middle between these two events has made holding an UN out west expensive, unpleasant, and hot. Have we forgotten the three pages of unhappiness and discontent over the cost of Purgatory? How many of ya'll signed up to attend, but cancelled at the last moment?

 

I'm offering an opportunity to ride the Sierra Nevada. Not just Yosemite but three mountain passes. (with a fourth a bit too far away to finish in daylight.) Between myself, BrianT, C_Williams, LBump, and others there will be plenty of locals to ride with. Late September is about the only time this can happen as the passes are usually snowed in until late June - early July. Once they're cleared all hell breaks loose for tourist season.

 

Mammoth Mountain Ski Resort is about 30 minutes south of Lee Vining. We could probably hold the UN there for around $200 a night, maybe get some structure and organized meals. Let me know if that's what you want and I'll think about it.

[Bernie]

I do agree with @Dennis Andress that if the UnRally or what ever it will be called in future would greatly benefit off being held in cooler temps.

The BMWST.com is a large enough group that it should be able to support 2 equal events on opposite side of the country without a problem.

I know that the big National clubs have been trying to move their events out of the July and August month due to high temps and complains from their members.

 

[Dennis Andress]

Why would we split it? Isn’t the whole idea of an annual national event to bring us together?

[Bernie]

2 minutes ago, Dennis Andress said:

Why would we split them? Isn’t the whole idea of a annual national event to bring us together?

Of course that sounds like a great idea. 

[beemerboy]

9 hours ago, Skywagon said:

..........I attended my first event this year in Arkansas............I felt a bit out of place when I got there.  I didn't know anyone, didn't know anyone to ride with, almost turned around and went home - seriously.  Improvement....there is always a leader of a group.  Have a leader meeting each morning or evening that is open for all to attend and buddy up with some group so that newcomers like me have someone to ride with.

 

I was really fortunate to meet Randy (quite by luck in the parking lot) and Andy.  They were nice enough to invite me on their rides and a couple of nights of dinner.  Had I not met Randy, I most likely would have returned home the next day...........

After joining this site in April of 2002 and I attended the first Un a few months later. Like you I didn't know anyone and when I showed up it was apparent that everyone knew everyone else but not me and it wasn't easy to strike up conversations, etc. When I arrived no one knew who "Beemerboy" was but a few folks were willing to extend a smile and a handshake. Living only a few hours away, I considered returning home but the urge to stick it out and try to make an adventure out of the experience overrode the my thoughts. I'm glad I did because I ended up being invited to ride with some nice guys from the Chicago 'burbs. The rest is history.

 

I had a great time but still left a day early because the Hell's Angels but that's a story for another day. I know your board name and have always enjoyed your posts. Had I been at this year's Un, you'd have had a riding and conversation buddy for sure! 

 

To you, @Skywagon and to any other noob considering attending a BMWST event, I say show up and introduce yourself and the rest will take care of itself. One more bit of advice, try showing up with a nice bottle of bourbon (to be consumed AFTER the ride day is done) because you'll make a lot of friends for sure.....especially me. 

 

Getting back on topic, I'm intrigued by the location and @Dennis Andress approach to planning this Un and will be lurking here and doing some of my own research on the 2025 Un area, logistics, etc.

 

 

9 hours ago, Skywagon said:

 

 

 

 

 

[mbelectric]

Great discussion!

 

Now, back to the dates….here’s another consideration that may strike a cord with a few heavyweights:

 

Place the Un and Torrey 50 dates close enough together to accomplish both within just over a week duration. I’m sure a few riders might be interested. 
 

Sorry, I’m retired and that sounded selfish..😉

[9Mary7]

6 hours ago, mbelectric said:

Great discussion!

 

Now, back to the dates….here’s another consideration that may strike a cord with a few heavyweights:

 

Place the Un and Torrey 50 dates close enough together to accomplish both within just over a week duration. I’m sure a few riders might be interested. 
 

Sorry, I’m retired and that sounded selfish..😉

That sounds interesting to me..... also being retired and trying to be more selfish.

[MikeB60]

7 hours ago, mbelectric said:

Place the Un and Torrey 50 dates close enough together to accomplish both within just over a week duration.

If I was retired and able to attend that would be my vote as well. 

[JCtx]

On 9/9/2024 at 9:18 AM, Indy Dave said:

It can be hard to welcome a new rider into an established ride group, and compromise one of the few great riding days you have all year.

That's a very good point, so I fully sympathize with that. Especially since I also ride very little (and only on fun roads), so when I go on a bike trip, it's TO RIDE, and spiritedly. So 'compromising one of the few great riding days' is exactly what I'd be doing with a 'first timer' group. So for somebody like me, who would feel right at home with the 'A' group from the beginning, I wouldn't be willing to waste a trip 'earning' my way up there. It'd be nice if it was the opposite: get accepted, and maybe get booted, if you don't measure up in any way. And no, I'm not the kind who'd ask to lead, or any other 'alpha' such behavior. I'd be happy wherever I was told to be. You could ask for track school certificates to prove riding ability (I could provide my SBS level 4). And no, scraping pegs on S1000RRs doesn't mean I ride like a maniac on the streets, because I don't. On the contrary; I'm a 62-y/o safe and smooth rider, who hasn't gotten a ticket (or been in an accident) in ages... which hope stays that way. Not that I don't speed, but I do it safely, and only when prudent. And remember I have a naked boxer R, which keeps me very relaxed (no urge to go fast). I'd probably have to raise my typical pace on straight portions with the fast group here, since I like to ride at 'the pace' (fast in twisties, relaxed on straights). But that's fun sometimes too, so wouldn't mind doing it at all.

 

Now, probably the main reason I've stayed safe is I only ride in good weather, AND on weekdays only. That last part is VERY important, especially with a fast group; riding spiritedly is already dangerous enough, and I want to keep doing it (ha ha), so I don't like to take extra risks. I've ridden mountain roads on weekends, and never again. Almost impossible to pass (at least safely), especially RVs, and people invading your lane too, so just not fun or safe to ride with traffic. And of course more chances of an accident as well. So if I could join one of your awesome rallies, I'd probably start on a Monday by myself, and end on a Friday, and drive back home (with my trailer) over the weekend. The first and last BMW rally I attended in the TX Hill Country long ago with the i-BMW forum (with a 'Pirate' guy. Ha ha), there were freaking cops everywhere, and a ton of traffic. And you needed to 'earn' your way to a top group, so was put on a 'beginner' group with freaking Harleys riding 2-up, so I just took off on my own. And glad I did. Was able to have some fun, and everybody on the fast group got at least 1 ticket, but I didn't. Ha ha. I was on my new '02 K1200RS 'brick' back then.

 

Finally, my ideal rally would be only with the fast group members, and on weekdays, for maximum safety and enjoyment, with little traffic, and hopefully no cops around (at least not more than normal). But I understand you guys already developed camaraderie, and your large rallies are more of a social event, than a riding one, so I'd probably just feel out of place there, like you said. But hopefully I can coincide with one of your events one of these days, ride on my own the first 3 or 4 days, and try with your group (if you allow me) Thursday and/or Friday, and see how it goes. I'm in an unfortunate situation to be too slow for sport-bike groups (too unsafe for me), and too fast for most sport-touring ones, so ride alone most of the time. I ride with my cousin often, who is slower than me, but he catches up quickly when it gets straight, so it has been great, especially since we have communicators, which makes it a lot more fun, and safe, at the same time. Two is my ideal group, since it makes it much easier for stops, and everything else. Sorry for the rambling... but you started.

[John Ranalletta]

1 hour ago, JCtx said:

But I understand you guys already developed camaraderie, and your large rallies are more of a social event, than a riding one,

Really?  A pizza night, a congregate dinner night, smoking cigars & a little whiskey at dusk don't make the ARTs "social events".  Most engines start early with many riders pulling in at dusk after logging hundreds of miles for 2-3 consecutive days.  The friendships we've formed over the years are an added and precious benefit.

 

[RTinNC]

6 minutes ago, John Ranalletta said:

Really?  A pizza night, a congregate dinner nigtht, smoking cigars & a little whiskey at dusk don't make the ARTs "social events".  Most engines start early with many riders pulling in at dusk after logging hundreds of miles for 2-3 consecutive days.  The friendships we've formed over the years are an added and precious benefit.

 

Actually the ARTs are social events .... after 5:00 !!    From sun up until 5:00 (or whenever you return back to the hotel) it's all about riding.  Guys are rolling out from sun up until about 9:00.  By 10:00 AM the parking lot is pretty dang empty.   But around 4;00 it starts to fill up and the socialization begins!   And I for one love BOTH the riding and the social aspect.  

[Dennis Andress]

Bitch all you want, just don't complain...

[BamaJohn]

9 hours ago, RTinNC said:

Actually the ARTs are social events .... after 5:00 !!    From sun up until 5:00 (or whenever you return back to the hotel) it's all about riding.  Guys AND GALS are rolling out from sun up until about 9:00.  By 10:00 AM the parking lot is pretty dang empty.   But around 4;00 it starts to fill up and the socialization begins!   And I for one love BOTH the riding and the social aspect.  

(FIX'D IT FOR YOU)

[RTinNC]

46 minutes ago, BamaJohn said:

(FIX'D IT FOR YOU)

Thank you.  

[Bernie]

Some of these replies sound like they may have been created by AI?

[Hosstage]

I don't want to ride with any of you, and I'm not really sure I want to spend time with you after a ride, but I'll be there! You just won't see me. Especially on Saturday or Sunday. Probably not Friday. But Tuesday and Wednesday I'm your guy. As long as it's not a group ride.

[John Ranalletta]

8 minutes ago, Hosstage said:

I don't want to ride with any of you, and I'm not really sure I want to spend time with you after a ride, but I'll be there! You just won't see me. Especially on Saturday or Sunday. Probably not Friday. But Tuesday and Wednesday I'm your guy. As long as it's not a group ride.

Post a picture so we'll know you're not hanging around.