Rider Etiquette?

[jssgranite]

Short story: was tailgated by a cage for a while last night. What do you do?

 

Long story: Riding home from work and was on a winding road about 10 miles long with speed limits in the 30 and 40 range. I typically limit speed to 5-10 over if nobody is in front of me as there are a lot of blind spots, it is fairly residential and people are always turning onto the road or left in front of me. Oh, and it was night.

 

Almost from the beginning of the road, a woman in a PT Cruiser decided to ride my back fender. I tried a variety of techniques including speeding up a bit, slowing down a bit. I even sat at a 4 way stop for a Looooonng time waiting for someone to come from either the left or the right that would turn in behind me. No such luck. She stayed with me until the road ended at a T intersection.

 

One of the things I love about the RT is the high compression and small flywheel making engine braking very effective. When rolling off throttle as I approach a curve I don't always engage a brake lever or pedal, and hence a brake light. I made sure I did last night because I wasn't sure she was perceptive enough to see that I was slowing approaching corners. Even so, she got really close several times. It is quite disconcerting to have to take eyes off the road in a curve to check the six in a mirror.

 

Back to the question. What do you guys do in these situations? Thanks.

[Firefight911]

Pull over and let them go.

[Boffin]

Pull over and wave them past - I am in no hurry to have thier accident.

 

Andy

[Joel]

Good thinking, when it comes to your brake light. I rely on engine braking a lot when I ride twisty roads, and I've thought about that often.

 

IMO, even better thinking would have been to pull off somewhere and let that driver pass. Anyone who consistently follows you that closely is putting both of you at higher risk. If he or she won't do something about it, you need to. I don't think varying your speed would be effective. Except at the extreme high end (which puts me at higher risk), it hasn't ever worked for me.

 

Edit: Man, I must type way slower than Phil and Andy.

[BereIsland]

I agree with all the above, but if you can't pull over safely, have a bigger gap between yourself and the traffic in front. Consider showing a brake light as you create this gap.

 

Steve

[Firefight911]

Edit: Man, I must type way slower than Phil and Andy.

 

Don't worry, mmmmmmmmmmmmmmkkkayyyyyy! Electrons and fingers work slower in the cold without Snickers!

[Joe Frickin' Friday]

Whenever I'm in the twisties and come up behind a slower vehicle - bike or car - I'm always grateful if they pull over when the opportunity presents itself. In mountainous territory you'll even see official signs suggesting as much: "SLOWER VEHICLES USE TURNOUTS."

 

It's not often that someone comes up on my six, but when it does happen, I try to make room (or pull over) for them to pass. A polite-but patient pursuer will follow at a safe distance; a polite-but-anxious pursuer will occasionally approach close if he thinks an opportunity to pass may be near; and a rude or unaware pursuer will ride your bumper until you get the hell out of his way. In this last case yielding is not so much a courtesy thing, it's more of a self-preservation thing: when someone is drafting you, it's bad enough on the straights where you're just waiting for an unexpected braking event, but in curvy roads where your speed keeps changing up and down, you're courting disaster.

 

Tailgating is rude and dangerous, and there's always an instinctive urge to punish the transgressor by blocking his pass, slowing way down, or spooking him by unexpectedly changing speeds. As much as we might like to enforce social order by such means, it's dangerous to do so; it's akin to berating an armed mugger who has demanded your wallet.

[Paul De]

While pulling over and letting said jerk pass is the correct answer, don't you feel like hacking up a big 'ol lugie and launch it high enough to have it land on said tailgaters windshield? Of course if you only wear full face helments this little poitically incorect action is not recommended

[Mike]

Jeff--

 

A long time ago, I read a piece about safe driving that was fairly elementary, but which I've always tried to keep in mind, whether on two wheels or four. The idea was so basic--you should constantly focus on maintaining a "safety cushion" around your vehicle, in every direction.

 

Truly, that's not always feasible, and it becomes increasingly so as traffic congestion and bad driving behavior increases, but I've applied it in exactly this type of situation in one of two ways--either by speeding up significantly and getting as far ahead of the tailgater as I can, or by simply pulling off the road and letting the person pass. I always feel like I have pretty good control over threats that are ahead of me, but I hate those things over which I have less control--those behind me.

 

I don't think that those who tailgate motorcycles are necessarily trying to be jerks. Sometimes it's a matter of visual fixation. Other times, drivers want to get past you, but they're befuddled by how to pass a small vehicle that's using up only part of the lane. Of course, they're are times that they're just being flaming asshats. Regardless of the motivation, they're a threat. Just pull over and let them drive by.

[Firefight911]

This topic got me thinking. Scary, I know!!

 

The act of simply pulling over needs to be looked at carefully. As I previously stated, it is the course of action that I utilize but you must be careful in doing so.

 

In the case of the arrogant tailgating "individual", or, for that matter, the uneducated you must be careful to protect your lane until you are able to find a safe and clear area to pull over.

 

Signal your intentions WAY in advance.

 

Protect your lane. If you start to move over to the right third of the lane, the tailgater my take the left side of your lane to make a pass. This will leave you with no safe cushion left to right.

 

Although, this action is against the law, it really won't matter after the fall!!!!!

 

Just wanted to add this to the post so that we all remember that we must make sound judgment calls on not only WHAT to do, but HOW best to do it.

 

[rdfrantz]

Jeff, my practice is to put on my turn signal, pull over and stop, and get at least one but preferably 2 vehicles between me and the close-following car.

 

However, I'm most interested in being able to keep that formerly close-following car clearly in view - but always with distance between me and it that absolutely would allow me to avoid it even if it stopped as quicly as running into a brick wall (Which, by the way, is what a head-on collision for them would be like). I'm wanting to look ahead of it at the emerging circumstances that its driver might poorly react to and create a danger situation for me, for example crashing and ending up sideways blocking the road, or perhaps turning onto a side street and then re-emerging (perhaps incautiously) onto my route. Well aware and informed of an emerging danger situation, I can get stopped, swerved or otherwise evade out of harms way. Like a drunk - whose behavior and reactions we will have difficulty predicting - any close-follower also - demonstrably - is not "manifesting the highest of rational and predicable behavior". Behind them I am far more in control of our (possible) and as yet unpredicable interactions.

 

I do not dally at bringing this about. I might make only one - or none - attempts to change their following distance.

 

I also - and I feel this is of paramount importance - I also calmly, and totally without visible irritation, conduct my actions to get away from being in front of them. I don't wave either, even in a "friendly" way; I just clearly take actions to get out of - and positively yield - the right of way. I'm being cautious not to evoke antagonism.

 

I also try to keep in my heart, to be mindful of, the fact that this person is being motivated out of needs that I manifestly do not share, and that I do not understand. But, they are a human, and like all humans, are only acting out of needs that are alive for them in this moment. As for my own needs, their behavior has brought to the fore my own need to live in a realm of well being and peace. I'll be well served if I pursue, directly and concertedly, placing myself only in situations that do not contain decisive threats to those needs and desires.

 

Let them go.

 

They are engaged in something that seems important to them. I'd like for us to be engaged, that means "have our attention upon", the most important task before us - as each of us might decide what that is. I'm wanting to get the disturbance they have brought, a mysterious disturbance, out of my life, and at least out in front of me where I can watch and better respond to its outcome(s).

 

Regardless of what seem so important to them... that's what's most important to me: Actively working at keeping peace and well being in my life.

 

I hope you all can make such a Gift to yourself and that other person.

 

 

Best wishes.

[Laura]

The last time we were out I was doing 80mph in the leftlane. I would be taking a leftlane exit only ramp so couldn't move to the right. There was a car in front of me so couldn't go faster if I wanted to. The van in back of me was right on my butt, scared the hell outta me. I sat up straight, put my lefthand out, down and open and pushed my hand back and forth like "back off sucker". The van backed right off, way off and stayed back there.

 

I found this to effective sometimes because it wakes cage drivers up to the fact that there is a person on that machine in front of them and that you're noticing them and are making them uncomfortable.

[jssgranite]

Thanks for all the great responses. I try to keep safety front and center when riding and avoid getting on the bike if 'get-there-itis' is pressing down on me. Unfortunately, lots of folks suffer from that during rush hour, which was when I was riding yesterday. In retrospect, I should have pulled off and did consider doing so. Perhaps at the time, my desire to be right ("that person shouldn't be on my a$$!!!") overcame my need to minimize risk.

 

Thanks for the great response Dick. I felt a calming just reading your post. You must be good at what you do.

[russell_bynum]

I'm with the "Move over and let them pass as soon as safely possible" crowd.

 

And like Dick said, signal your intentions well in advance. I came up on a slower vehicle the other day on a twisty 2-lane (in the cage). After following for about 1/2 mile, the vehicle suddenly slammed on the brakes and swerved off onto the shoulder...which was hardly a shoulder at all. There was no way I could get around without putting myself on the wrong side of the road in a blind turn, and his action was so sudden, unexpected, and illogical that I was lucky not to hit him. (I know...I need to be farther back. My bad.)

 

Don't do something spastic and emotional. Signal your intentions, then execute on those intentions in a positive and predictable way.

[Ken H.]

I think you can try what Laura is suggesting maybe once. Or a full look over your shoulder back at them, might get the message communicated to someone who honestly doesn't realize what they are doing is a serious hazard to you. Beyond that, if they still don't get it, pull over and let 'em go.

[russell_bynum]

I think you can try what Laura is suggesting maybe once. Or a full look over your shoulder back at them, might get the message communicated to someone who honestly doesn't realize what they are doing is a serious hazard to you. Beyond that, if they still don't get it, pull over and let 'em go.

 

Move over anyway.

 

If they came up behind you, it's because they're going faster than you. Therefore, you should allow them to pass as soon as is prudent.

 

Laura's situation was a bit different since she needed to be over there for an upcomming exit (left-side exits are stupid, but that's for another topic. ), and there was a car ahead of her anyway.

[rocks]

The last time we were out I was doing 80mph in the leftlane. I would be taking a leftlane exit only ramp so couldn't move to the right. There was a car in front of me so couldn't go faster if I wanted to. The van in back of me was right on my butt, scared the hell outta me. I sat up straight, put my lefthand out, down and open and pushed my hand back and forth like "back off sucker". The van backed right off, way off and stayed back there.

 

+1

This has also worked for me in similar situations.

[Paul Mihalka]

Some times putting on the four-way flasher helps. If I come to a legal passing zone with nobody coming I slow down and wave them by.

[drharveys]

Sometimes a little jiggle of the handlebars will cause the tailgater to think your bike's about to break, they'll slow down and you can find a place to pull over.

 

Of course, this tactic isn't very effective when the tailgunner is talking on the cell phone, changing the CD, diapering the baby, drinking a latte or Big Gulp and, oh yeah, attempting to drive!

 

And where are the traffic cops while all this dangerous behavior is taking place?? Usually manning a radar trap someplace where the speed limit is set artificially low!

[John_Fischer]

When I'm tailgated I sometimes give the "peace symbol" of two fingers up in a vee configuration which also may be interpreted as "please remember the two second rule for safe following distance".For some reason it does seem to work for me. Just be certain that your index finger is closer to the tailgater than that other finger. You could be in a poor circumstance if the gesture was mis-interpreted.

[awagnon]

I agree with pulling over and letting the tailgater pass. But sometimes in the twisties on two lane roads, there just isn't a good (ie, safe) place to pull over and a double line prevents them from passing. Then I guess I'd try Laura's hand signal repeatedly.

 

Not to change the subject or hijack the thread: But you mentioned engine braking before the curve. David Hough gave a good talk at the RA rally in Boise. He strongly advised against using engine braking before curves. I can't recall his entire reasoning, but I'm sure it had to do with available rear tire traction. I admit that's what I do, but was wondering about others.

[jackflash]

In my very small sports car and on my bikes, I put on the 4 way blinkers when being tailgating and it almost always works. I think it draws attention they don't want. If that doesn't work, I let them by if the road allows me to.

 

If most people had seen lives ruined on the witness stand in a court room like I have, general behavior in this country would be different. However much insurance a driver carries (if they have it), isn't enough...umbrella policies included. There are lawyers out there (like mine) that are educated, and experienced to ruin people for making mistakes. My job has made me watch it happen too many times. Some people just don't know how bad, bad can get.

[russell_bynum]

If that doesn't work, I let them by if the road allows me to.

 

WTF? Let them by if the road allows you to anyway.

 

If they came up behind you, it's because they're going faster than you. Move over and let them by. Problem solved.

[jackflash]

If that doesn't work, I let them by if the road allows me to.

 

WTF? Let them by if the road allows you to anyway.

 

If they came up behind you, it's because they're going faster than you. Move over and let them by. Problem solved.

 

Maybe YOU do, but I'm not letting a car pass me on a curve, where there is NO SHOULDER to pull off on, if I'm on an interior lane with traffic beside me, and many other circumstance that are UNSAFE.

 

Don't WTF me buddy. Pull your head out and learn some common courtesy towards fellow forum members.

[Gregori]

<<SNIP>>

Fortunately the threat while being tailgated isn't often accute, so I keep a cool head -- I'll generally let them pass. I figure if somebody is in a position to be tailgating ME, they're either crazy or in a serious hurry. In either case, I don't want to be in their way, and the easiest solution is to let them by...

(That, or it's one of this DBs members riding something other than an RT on Sweeper Madness, in which case it's just simple courtesy to wave them on by.)

 

G

 

(On edit, removed mugger beating story)

[ratfink]

On my V-strom I would pull over if safe to do so. It has a signal minder with escort (wig wag) mode. I might try that too.

 

This is usually not a problem when I am on my RT-P.

 

Regards, RTFink

[russell_bynum]

If that doesn't work, I let them by if the road allows me to.

 

WTF? Let them by if the road allows you to anyway.

 

If they came up behind you, it's because they're going faster than you. Move over and let them by. Problem solved.

 

Maybe YOU do, but I'm not letting a car pass me on a curve, where there is NO SHOULDER to pull off on, if I'm on an interior lane with traffic beside me, and many other circumstance that are UNSAFE.

 

Don't WTF me buddy. Pull your head out and learn some common courtesy towards fellow forum members.

 

Am I missing something here?

 

You said: In my very small sports car and on my bikes, I put on the 4 way blinkers when being tailgating and it almost always works. I think it draws attention they don't want. If that doesn't work, I let them by if the road allows me to.

 

So...you put on your 4-way blinkers to get someone to stop tailgating you. If that doesn't work, then you move over and let them by if the roadway allows.

 

My point was...even if it DOES work (i.e. if it makes them fall back a bit), you should still move over and let them by as soon as the roadway allows. The root of the problem is that they want to go faster than you, and you're in front of them. Letting them by fixes the problem for both of you.

 

Right?

 

Obviously I'm not saying you should do something stupid/unsafe to let them by. I'm just saying what you said...as soon as the road allows, let them by.

[jackflash]

If that doesn't work, I let them by if the road allows me to.

 

WTF? Let them by if the road allows you to anyway.

 

If they came up behind you, it's because they're going faster than you. Move over and let them by. Problem solved.

 

Maybe YOU do, but I'm not letting a car pass me on a curve, where there is NO SHOULDER to pull off on, if I'm on an interior lane with traffic beside me, and many other circumstance that are UNSAFE.

 

Don't WTF me buddy. Pull your head out and learn some common courtesy towards fellow forum members.

 

Am I missing something here?

 

You said: In my very small sports car and on my bikes, I put on the 4 way blinkers when being tailgating and it almost always works. I think it draws attention they don't want. If that doesn't work, I let them by if the road allows me to.

 

So...you put on your 4-way blinkers to get someone to stop tailgating you. If that doesn't work, then you move over and let them by if the roadway allows.

 

My point was...even if it DOES work (i.e. if it makes them fall back a bit), you should still move over and let them by as soon as the roadway allows. The root of the problem is that they want to go faster than you, and you're in front of them. Letting them by fixes the problem for both of you.

 

Right?

 

Obviously I'm not saying you should do something stupid/unsafe to let them by. I'm just saying what you said...as soon as the road allows, let them by.

 

What we have here is a failure to communicate, mostly on my part in the beginning. Of course I let people by when there is an open lane. I have no death wish. I didn't make that clear but didn't expect to get attacked either. I will defend myself aggressively with an aggressor. If you're having a bad day, go kick the dog or somebody else but do it face to face.

 

End of subject. Over and out. Goodbye.

[E30TECH]

The last time we were out I was doing 80mph in the leftlane. I would be taking a leftlane exit only ramp so couldn't move to the right. There was a car in front of me so couldn't go faster if I wanted to. The van in back of me was right on my butt, scared the hell outta me. I sat up straight, put my lefthand out, down and open and pushed my hand back and forth like "back off sucker". The van backed right off, way off and stayed back there.

 

+1

This has also worked for me in similar situations.

 

+2

[rrrich]

I like Ed's solution to tailgaters but Grouch seems to be sitting this one out.

 

(Can you tell it's winter already? Tempers boys...)

 

[ShovelStrokeEd]

The new, politically correct and gentler Grouch now longer carries one inch ball bearings in his tank bag. The S isn't emitting those two foot flames out the pipes anymore either.

 

I would still love, one of these days, to build a little clockwork mechanism into my tail trunk that opened the top of the trunk and had some form of creature emerge and then pick up and display a sign saying "Please back off a bit" or words to that effect, and then pop back in and close the trunk. Maybe some day, sigh.

[NoHeat]

MSF's advice is that when you've got a tailgater behind you, you should increase the distance between you and the car IN FRONT of you.

 

That's in the booklet they give you at their Basic Rider Course.

 

It doesn't come with an explanation, but I suppose the idea is this: if the car in front of you suddenly brakes, you will be able to apply your brakes more gently, because of your increased distance. That will make it less likely the tailgater behind you will hit you when you brake.

[Bud]

The last time we were out I was doing 80mph in the leftlane. I would be taking a leftlane exit only ramp so couldn't move to the right. There was a car in front of me so couldn't go faster if I wanted to. The van in back of me was right on my butt, scared the hell outta me. I sat up straight, put my lefthand out, down and open and pushed my hand back and forth like "back off sucker". The van backed right off, way off and stayed back there.

 

I found this to effective sometimes because it wakes cage drivers up to the fact that there is a person on that machine in front of them and that you're noticing them and are making them uncomfortable.

 

When in city traffic on an interstate where there were no places to pull off and really no other lane to jump into without putting myself and others at risk, I have use the same hand signal and it seems to have helped.

 

Still a very scary environment. Rush hour, bumper to bumper. I prefer to stay in a lane with a shoulder when possible. However, pulling off onto that shoulder has problems of its own. Trying to get back into the flow of traffic is risky.

 

YMMV

[DiggerJim]

The new, politically correct and gentler Grouch now longer carries one inch ball bearings in his tank bag.

What's wrong with the ball bearings? They've always worked for me.

 

[OlGeezer]

I do one of two things:

 

If it doesn't look like the tailgater is intent on passing, I put my left hand down sortof in the "stop" position and waive my hand trying to send a "back off" motion. This usually works. The other cases, where it is apparent the tailgater is trying to pass, I move over (turnouts) at the first opportunity. It's not worth riding too fast to stay in front or to block if s/he tries to pass. This could also be a good opportunity to promote a good motorcycle image by taking on a passive role in this particular confrontation.

 

Just my opinion.

[rocks]

I would still love, one of these days, to build a little clockwork mechanism into my tail trunk that opened the top of the trunk and had some form of creature emerge and then pick up and display a sign saying "Please back off a bit" or words to that effect, and then pop back in and close the trunk. Maybe some day, sigh.

 

Back when I was a kid in high school my buddie had a Saab and then as now you were able to crawl through the back seat into the trunk... with the automatic trunk release we gave a few driver's in back of us quite the scare

[Firefight911]

I would still love, one of these days, to build a little clockwork mechanism into my tail trunk that opened the top of the trunk and had some form of creature emerge and then pick up and display a sign saying "Please back off a bit" or words to that effect, and then pop back in and close the trunk. Maybe some day, sigh.

 

Back when I was a kid in high school my buddie had a Saab and then as now you were able to crawl through the back seat into the trunk... with the automatic trunk release we gave a few driver's in back of us quite the scare

 

That is awesome!!!!!

[tallman]

Depends on road, weather, lighting.

Ease off gesture works sometimes.

Maybe they're just trying to read my decals?

Dick's thoughtful post is where I should be mentally.

But I like knowing I have room for improvement.

[Quinn]

In my car, I always wanted to take the rear window washer and point it straight back. When tailgated, I could just tap it to send a squirt of water at the offender's windshield. Then I thought that brake fuild would be even more effective than water. We all have fantasies, don't we?

[DiggerJim]

In my car, I always wanted to take the rear window washer and point it straight back. When tailgated, I could just tap it to send a squirt of water at the offender's windshield.

Now that's just freakin' brilliant. And pretty easy to implement. Got some time on my hands and now I have a project I don't have a rear window washer but I have the technology, the tools, the will and now the idea! Thank you Santa.

 

Jim

[gdouglas]

In my younger days we had a cure for nighttime tailgaters. I would stand on the center stand at highway speed for a couple of seconds and the tailgater would have his car lit up with sparks across his/her hood and windshield. 99% of them got the message loud and clear and backed off. Now, in my later years with a little bit more wisdom and patience, I prefer to give them the oportunity to pass and get in front so I can give them the full rage of the 1200RT highbeam. The latter method sure saves on centerstand maintenance.

[Stir]

What has worked for me is putting my left arm straight down with my palm towards the car and waving them off. It is a friendly enough jesture. I have used that when it is not practical to pull over.

[rrrich]

...LIL HIJACK HERE...

 

gdouglas' post is a PERFECT example of why this DB, and the internet that enables it, is the most fantastic thing since the pill.

 

Imagine how many campfires you'd a hafta been sittin round bullsh*ting with riders before youda EVER heard that one? Ida been one old(er) fart before THAT precious lil tip ever floated by.

 

...END LIL HIJACK...

 

To paraphrase our friend in Simsbury..."what a freaking great idea!" Next time I get a nighttime tailgater I'm going to stand on the centerstand instead of toss the ball bearing.

 

[E30TECH]

In my car, I always wanted to take the rear window washer and point it straight back. When tailgated, I could just tap it to send a squirt of water at the offender's windshield. Then I thought that brake fuild would be even more effective than water. We all have fantasies, don't we?

 

I was going to do just that in an old POS car I had (Mazda MX6). I went as far as buying the washer pump while I was with my (at the time, now my wife) girlfriend. She said "what do you need that for". I told her that it was going to pump acid on the cars that tailgate me. She got all bent out of shape, so I put the pump back on the shelf. I have since sold the car and dont want to do that with my new truck.

[Paul Mihalka]

Just using your normal windshield washer might help, and they can't complain about it. Won't help when you are riding

[DiggerJim]

Just using your normal windshield washer might help, and they can't complain about it. Won't help when you are riding

Au contraire! The pump & reservoir fit nicely in my system case with quick connect wiring that stashes under my passenger seat when I'm not loaded for game

 

Just waiting on a new squirty nozzle - had one from the back of a van but that's pointed the wrong way. Getting one for a headlight washer. (So, I had a misspent holiday )

 

Jim