traffic stop story

[smiller]

Well you probably shouldn't have spat at the guy.

[Agent_Orange]

Where did you get it? And what were you driving/riding?

[onmyrt]

Would you rather have the alternative?

If the alternative is consistent and fair, absolutely!

 

The principle being debated here is our 'respect for the law'.

 

Laws that are inconsistently enforced are difficult to respect,

as are law enforcers who are themselves law violators.

[Joe Frickin' Friday]

My last ticket (about 5 years ago) was for 6 mph over.

 

I once got pulled over and lectured for passing a cop on the interstate. He was doing exactly the speed limit (sez he), and it took me about a minute to creep by him, so I'm pretty sure I was exceeding his speed by all of about 0.2 miles per hour. Got an earful of blather about "zero tolerance" and on and on before he finally let me go on my way without a ticket.

 

[smiller]

Would you rather have the alternative?

If the alternative is consistent and fair, absolutely!

But let's get real, that's not the alternative. The alternative is rigid enforcement of lowest common denominator speed limits.

 

It's true that the better option would be to set limits at a proper (defined by thge median speed, etc.) level vs. using a political or revenue-enhancement standard. Good luck with that, and while we're waiting I'll welcome the occasional positive discretion on the part of the LEO.

 

[David]

Where did you get it? And what were you driving/riding?

 

I was in my truck, on a secondary road about a mile north of our house. Four lane, undivided road.

 

As soon as I saw the lights (he was hiding behind a tree, and ran to his car), I pulled over into a residential street. I thought for sure I'd get a warning, but I was shocked to get the ticket.

 

Oh well. I'd have gone to jail if I'd been caught at various other times.

[smiller]

... he was hiding behind a tree ...

Love that. Really boosts that ol' respect for law enforcement, huh?

[skinny_tom (aka boney)]

I am traveling at an indicated 75 mph in an effort to prevent traffic from stacking up behind and as a courtesy to the other commuters behind me.

 

Thank you. I wasn't anywhere near, but there's nothing worse than traffic stacking up behind an LEO who isn't travelling at "traffic speed."

 

 

If you ever go in front of a judge for speeding, use that line and see how it works for you.

 

I'm gonna tempt fate, right here and right now. I haven't had the pleasure of being given the chance to be face to face with a judge in many, many years. I'll chalk it up to (mostly) sensible riding, a bit of luck, and a few very nice LEOs.

 

[upflying]

I should add the traveling at or below the speed limit could also get you a ticket. An example would be ice, snow or fog. 25mph may be the maximum safe speed in a 65mph zone in these circumstances.

Another example of safe speed would be reading or applying make-up while driving. It could be argued the maximum safe speed in these circumstances is zero.

Combination vehicles also have lower speed limits.

BTW, in some cases it could be argued that the safe speed is greater than the speed limit. I would argue that if I was cited for 45mph in a 35 mph zone at 3am in a deserted commercial district.

[skinny_tom (aka boney)]

There's gotta be a better way.

 

I'm open to hearing about your ideas. Not that it would help, since I'm not an LEO or a position to make a difference.

 

I feel that if you're willing to tell us your gripe, you should be willing to give us your solutions too.

 

 

[upflying]

There's gotta be a better way.

 

I'm open to hearing about your ideas. Not that it would help, since I'm not an LEO or a position to make a difference.

 

I feel that if you're willing to tell us your gripe, you should be willing to give us your solutions too.

 

The only better way is to take the human element out of it. Say hello to the speed camera with zero tolerance.

[marcopolo]

I, for one, am glad to see police officers using some discretion. Not all situations are so black and white that we should remove the element of discretion from them. Does anyone really expect police to stop and ticket every vehicle that's traveling 1 mph over the limit? Let's use our heads a little bit.

 

Two years ago, I was riding two-up with my wife towards Cody WY (where we were spending the night). There were some rather ominous black clouds approaching so I cranked the throttle somewhat to try and avoid the threat of lightning. There was a state trooper coming the other way and he turned on his lights and pulled a u-turn. I said that I knew I was speeding, but explained the circumstances. He sent me on my way with a warning and I appreciated his exercise of discretion.

[Boffin]

There's gotta be a better way.

 

I'm open to hearing about your ideas. Not that it would help, since I'm not an LEO or a position to make a difference.

 

I feel that if you're willing to tell us your gripe, you should be willing to give us your solutions too.

 

The only better way is to take the human element out of it. Say hello to the speed camera with zero tolerance.

 

Our cameras have a "tolerance" of the speed limit +10% +1mph, go over that speed and "Flash....Flash", the "notice of intended prosecution" is in the post. That's when you have to declare who the driver was. "Darling - I have 9 points - if I get this ticket I lose my licence - can I put you as the driver?....."

 

Andy

[smiller]

That's when you have to declare who the driver was.

So if you were driving you are forced to incriminate yourself?

[Boffin]

That's when you have to declare who the driver was.

So if you were driving you are forced to incriminate yourself?

 

Yes. It comes from having no written constitution. Even Magna Carta has been all-but torn up in the recent past. I can say no more without having to ban myself on the no-politics rule.

 

Andy

[Matts_12GS]

A few months back, Mitch posted a thread about handling a traffic stop as the offender.

 

I read it and really enjoyed it, more to the point I internalized the information.

 

I have been stopped twice for radar stops on my RT at speeds that were close to 20 over. Both times, my license was run but courtesy and acknowledgment of my transgressions resulted in nothing more than a verbal warning in either of them.

 

I thank the officers for their use of discretion, but in reality, which of us has a job in which we have NO discretion or allowance for judgment? Why should law enforcement be any different with regard to traffic control? Killing someone is still killing someone whether it was self defense or premeditated but there are legal conditions for both ends of that spectrum.

 

In the long view of it all, I'd much rather drive near/around an officer who will sit a bit above the speed limit so that traffic will flow at least near the limit.

 

I have often wanted to be a LEO so that I could pull the person who refuses to pass me when I'm going under the limit. I'd like to see just what they're afraid of!

[onmyrt]

The only better way is to take the human element out of it. Say hello to the speed camera with zero tolerance.

Actually, that is what I suggested earlier in the thread.

 

Though I doubt that speed cameras are set to zero tolerance,

probably more like +5 or something close to that.

 

The advantage that I see in using cameras, is consistency.

They're not biased. If your speeding, you're cited. Done!

 

There's something about that clarity that makes it an acceptable alternative to me.

[smiller]

Then you might want to move to Arizona, I hear residents there are absolutely thrilled with the speed cameras...

[smiller]

It comes from having no written constitution.

I didn't know that fact about the UK. If I follow the wiki article correctly, the legislative branch both makes the laws and is also the judge of their legitimacy?

[Boffin]

It comes from having no written constitution.

I didn't know that fact about the UK. If I follow the wiki article correctly, the legislative branch both makes the laws and is also the judge of their legitimacy?

 

The laws are made by the political legislature (the House of Commons), but interpreted by the courts which are independent of government. The highest court however, is the upper chamber of parliament, the House of Lords - specifically the Law Lords. These are (usually) senior judges who have been raised to the peerage and are not elected. Whereas many lords have party allegiances, they can only be removed by royal prerogative and they take their independence seriously. Mostly it works, some recent laws passed under the guise of anti-terror legislation however seem to be beyond the pail to me.

 

Andy

[Rotor]

I just have this to say about all that:

Decide for yourself...

[betty]

I should add the traveling at or below the speed limit could also get you a ticket. An example would be ice, snow or fog. 25mph may be the maximum safe speed in a 65mph zone in these circumstances.

 

So the LEO is able to size up your vehicle (snow tires or not, abs or not, all wheel drive or not), know your skill, training and experience driving in adverse conditions before he pulls you over?

BS. A properly equipped and driven vehicle will be safer at faster speeds than mom driving her minivan full of screaming kids with an ill equipped vehicle. The LEO has no way of knowing this so a ticket for driving safely at the speed limit in adverse conditions would be a cash grab-as are most speed traps. Waldo or Stark FL anyone?

[Boone60]

The only better way is to take the human element out of it. Say hello to the speed camera with zero tolerance.

Actually, that is what I suggested earlier in the thread.

 

Though I doubt that speed cameras are set to zero tolerance,

probably more like +5 or something close to that.

 

The advantage that I see in using cameras, is consistency.

They're not biased. If your speeding, you're cited. Done!

 

There's something about that clarity that makes it an acceptable alternative to me.

 

 

I disagree with this position, and believe that an officer with good discretion is much preferrable to a camera.

 

Thanks for the thread Upflying.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[skinny_tom (aka boney)]

BS. A properly equipped and driven vehicle will be safer at faster speeds than mom driving her minivan full of screaming kids with an ill equipped vehicle. The LEO has no way of knowing this so a ticket for driving safely at the speed limit in adverse conditions would be a cash grab-as are most speed traps. Waldo or Stark FL anyone?

 

When was the last time you saw a "properly equipped and driven vehicle?"

 

I'm just sayin'

[ghaverkamp]

I should add the traveling at or below the speed limit could also get you a ticket. An example would be ice, snow or fog. 25mph may be the maximum safe speed in a 65mph zone in these circumstances.

 

So the LEO is able to size up your vehicle (snow tires or not, abs or not, all wheel drive or not), know your skill, training and experience driving in adverse conditions before he pulls you over?

BS. A properly equipped and driven vehicle will be safer at faster speeds than mom driving her minivan full of screaming kids with an ill equipped vehicle. The LEO has no way of knowing this so a ticket for driving safely at the speed limit in adverse conditions would be a cash grab-as are most speed traps. Waldo or Stark FL anyone?

 

It's not the officer's job or responsibility to know for certain. It's the officer's job to make a judgment based on the circumstances, leaving it to the courts to make a final determination, just as in any other endeavor in which we engage law enforcement.

 

 

[sgendler]

I, for one, am glad to see police officers using some discretion. Not all situations are so black and white that we should remove the element of discretion from them. Does anyone really expect police to stop and ticket every vehicle that's traveling 1 mph over the limit? Let's use our heads a little bit.

 

Two years ago, I was riding two-up with my wife towards Cody WY (where we were spending the night). There were some rather ominous black clouds approaching so I cranked the throttle somewhat to try and avoid the threat of lightning. There was a state trooper coming the other way and he turned on his lights and pulled a u-turn. I said that I knew I was speeding, but explained the circumstances. He sent me on my way with a warning and I appreciated his exercise of discretion.

 

I guess the alternative is discretion in punishment but black and white enforcement. I got pulled over for the exact same reason as you did while riding into ABQ once, and the officer gave me the ticket. I don't remember my speed, but it was somewhere between 5 and 15mph over the limit on a straight stretch of desert highway. I was pretty surprised to get the ticket instead of a warning since the ominous clouds were almost right on top of us, but when I showed up at the ABQ courthouse 2 days later (I was planning to ask about traffic school options for an out of stater), I discovered that there was an automatic plea deal available which cost $5 and postponed the fine for a year. If you didn't get another ticket in a year, the fine and points never went on your record. Had I paid the ticket via mail, I'd have never known about the option to get out of the ticket. Since I only ever ride in New Mexico once or twice a year, it is now my official policy to haul ass whenever I do, until I get my $5 ticket. Then I slow down This policy is aided by the fact that you can walk into the courthouse to pay on the day after getting a citation.

[motorman587]

Can not speed in a police car in my town. People call the department or even get pulled by the highway patrol and then call the department. You get a piece of paper put in your file, where it could hurt for a promotion etc.......If you get another paper within a year you get suspended. A third fired. It's funny on the interstate when going the speed limit. Get the "stacking" affect when I can see the traffic for miles behind me cause they are scared to pass. Outstanding!!! Some departments go by the book. We get in trouble for using bad words...............

Many agencies are now installing GPS hardware in patrol vehicles. This not only helps locate the closest patrol vehicle to an emergency, it also keeps track of the officer's speed. The days of speeding LEO vehicles could be numbered. BTW John, how do you not speed if you are trying to catch up to a speeder? Do you go to urgent calls at exactly the speed limit? Some routine patrol could involve speeding. Does that mean you have to use lights and siren everytime you drive over the speed limit? Some agencies require supervisor approval to operate "code 3". If the Florida Highway Patrol wrote you a speeding ticket while you are on duty, how would that case be handled if you contested the ticket in front of a judge you know?

 

Per our department policies and Florida statue when a you (LEO) violate the law, ie going after a speeder etc..... you must have your emergency equipment on. Routine patrol, speed limit. Yup, that is my world. Have been stopped in a marked police car by the Florida Highway Patrol. Was many many many years ago. Florida Trooper "must" write a citation in an at fault police car crash, ie example police car backs into a parked car. Police officer gets ticket, on or off duty.

[RPG]

I should add the traveling at or below the speed limit could also get you a ticket. An example would be ice, snow or fog. 25mph may be the maximum safe speed in a 65mph zone in these circumstances.

Another example of safe speed would be reading or applying make-up while driving. It could be argued the maximum safe speed in these circumstances is zero.

Combination vehicles also have lower speed limits.

BTW, in some cases it could be argued that the safe speed is greater than the speed limit. I would argue that if I was cited for 45mph in a 35 mph zone at 3am in a deserted commercial district.

 

 

good discussion here for sure:

 

With all these factors thrown in, all the more reason to let the individual determine what their safe speed is, at least on major highways. Will the idiots still kill people? Of course, they're doing it now and did it when the National speed limit was 55.

And wasn't that the case several years ago when Montana and some others allowed "No limits", where the data showed that people for the most part still drove at or near the old posted speeds?

 

All comes down to personal responsibility, skill, personal judgement on road conditions and respect for the other people on the road.

 

After participating in several Track Days with Reg Pridmore and with more than 200k miles on bikes, I have total confidence in my abilities riding at 80+mph. The RT feels planted and hardly working at those speeds. Doesn't make me reckless, I don't think,

although the MI court system would definitely not agree.

 

As others have stated, it's hard to abide by the law when it's inconsistently enforced.

 

Now what did I do with that new $400 radar detector??

 

RG

 

 

[lopaca]

If we want to go fast and not get a ticket, then we need to go to the track. That is what they are for.

 

If we want to go fast on streets and highways (regardless of the reason) then we must certainly realize that there is a chance we will get a ticket.

 

It is really quite simple. We can intellectualize the issue to death. Why do you stop at red light and stop signs? Because it is safer to do so. If you don't want to stop, don't stop, but don't complain when someone slams into you. You knew that was a possibility. Other than this 55 mph bull crap knee jerk gas shortage legislation left over from the 70s most speed limits are based on safety factors - yeah they actually pay engineers that love working with numbers come up with these numbers. And yes they do keep track of accidents in various areas and adjust speed limits based on those statistics.

 

It doesn't mean you can't go over, it just means that you are increasing the risk of an accident as well as getting a ticket. Is it just another way to tax us? Of course it is. Do the insurance companies love a reason to raise your rates? Last I heard, they are in business to make a profit.

 

It is all about choice, but don't whine when you get a ticket. You know if you go over that can happen. Right? What am I missing here?

 

You can talk about big brother and fascist regimes only so long. The fact is that there are too many people on the road all at the same time to allow each one to determine what is safe and what is not.

 

I have had my share of fast rides, both cages and bikes and I too love the thrill of speed. I have also had my share of speeding tickets. Was I surprised when I got pulled over? Maybe the kind of "where did you come from?" surprise, but certainly not the "why did you pull me over?" surprise.

 

Maybe the discussion should be more about accountability.

[wellcraft]

so you yourself were breaking the law by traveling 75 in a 65 and you have the nerve to give somneone a ticket??????

[Dave McReynolds]

I, for one, am glad to see police officers using some discretion. Not all situations are so black and white that we should remove the element of discretion from them. Does anyone really expect police to stop and ticket every vehicle that's traveling 1 mph over the limit? Let's use our heads a little bit.

 

You want to see "discretion?" Try driving in Oregon with a California license plate. Get used to being followed for miles just waiting for you to fail to signal a lane change, go any number of miles over the speed limit, or if all else fails, maybe your license plate cover is partially blocking your current registration sticker.

[upflying]

so you yourself were breaking the law by traveling 75 in a 65 and you have the nerve to give somneone a ticket??????

Asked and answered.

[Marty Hill]

Bob, as you can see there are a few guys that have no life and just like to moan about everything. Sad, but remember that most don't take every opportunity to blast Leo's. Guess the poor babies got an award once and just can't get over it. Kinda funny when you look at it that way.

 

Stay safe and keep doing it your way!

[KDeline]

 

It's not the officer's job or responsibility to know for certain. It's the officer's job to make a judgment based on the circumstances, leaving it to the courts to make a final determination, just as in any other endeavor in which we engage law enforcement.

 

 

The problem there is that the judge will almost always agree with the sworn patrolman.

[KDeline]

Bob, as you can see there are a few guys that have no life and just like to moan about everything.

 

 

Hey I have a life, I'm just retired now and have nothing better to do.

[Paul Mihalka]

Thank haven for police officer discretion. If not, I would have three times the tickets I've actually got

[bmwsit]

I, for one, am glad to see police officers using some discretion. Not all situations are so black and white that we should remove the element of discretion from them. Does anyone really expect police to stop and ticket every vehicle that's traveling 1 mph over the limit? Let's use our heads a little bit.

 

You want to see "discretion?" Try driving in Oregon with a California license plate. Get used to being followed for miles just waiting for you to fail to signal a lane change, go any number of miles over the speed limit, or if all else fails, maybe your license plate cover is partially blocking your current registration sticker.

 

License plate covers are illegal...........

[RET2]

I would hope he's refering to a frame around the plate but? Any way for my $.02 can we just be thankful that the LEO's are by and large out to provide a safety service and just ignore the "passionate" indivduals on both far ends of the spectrum? Or do I have to start an "OIL" thread to end all of this?

[Vicious_Cycler]

I should add the traveling at or below the speed limit could also get you a ticket. An example would be ice, snow or fog. 25mph may be the maximum safe speed in a 65mph zone in these circumstances.

 

So the LEO is able to size up your vehicle (snow tires or not, abs or not, all wheel drive or not), know your skill, training and experience driving in adverse conditions before he pulls you over?

BS. A properly equipped and driven vehicle will be safer at faster speeds than mom driving her minivan full of screaming kids with an ill equipped vehicle. The LEO has no way of knowing this so a ticket for driving safely at the speed limit in adverse conditions would be a cash grab-as are most speed traps. Waldo or Stark FL anyone?

 

Maybe or maybe not your individual skill and vehicle, but he or she is likely to be able to evaluate your behavior as it relates to other drivers. You may personally be able to drive like Dario Franchitti but doing so may be very disruptive to Mrs. McGillicudy and the rest of us lessor skilled drivers. The LEO likely makes a judgement based on the big picture of which an individual driver may not be aware.

 

Even if I get a performance award, especially on the motorbike, I figure I'm still to the good for all the times I didn't get caught. Right Bob?

[upflying]

Vicious says:

Even if I get a performance award, especially on the motorbike, I figure I'm still to the good for all the times I didn't get caught. Right Bob?

 

Isn't that what R1150RT stands for?

Remuneration (for) Retroactive Transgressions

[bmwsit]

License plate covers...a clear or tinted piece of plastic that covers the plate.......illegal

[Agent_Orange]

Human.

[tallman]

Hey Woodsie, long time.

Best wishes.

[Boone60]

Have been stopped in a marked police car by the Florida Highway Patrol.

 

That wouldn't go over to good up this way. A lesson in discretion was given several years ago, and it started when a Wisconsin State Trooper ticketed a Green Bay police officer. It wasn't long afterwards that the trooper had to ask for a peace treaty, as he was one ticket away from the last of his drivers license points and then would be unable to do his job.

[lopaca]

 

It's not the officer's job or responsibility to know for certain. It's the officer's job to make a judgment based on the circumstances, leaving it to the courts to make a final determination, just as in any other endeavor in which we engage law enforcement.

 

 

The problem there is that the judge will almost always agree with the sworn patrolman.

 

You are kidding, right? I can appreciate your right to your opinion and more so your right to state it, but really?

 

Maybe we should all take turns sitting as a traffic judge. I have sat as a traffic judge occasionally over the years and while I understand that everyone assumes a traffic judge is devoid of common sense and an understanding of the law, the reality is that the judge does listen to both sides and gives each the same consideration, whether the testimony is from a uniformed police officer, someone dressed in a suit, a mom there with her stroller and baby, the biker with the tattoos and braided beard, or the garage owner who shows up in his work clothes and oil stained hands. If is not an easy job. You have to listen to the evidence and then be accountable to the parties on each side that you are following the law and giving each their day in court. It is an exhausting day, and at the end of the day you spend the entire evening praying that you did the right thing in each and every case.

 

Statements such as this demonstrates a lack of understanding and appreciation of reality. I would suggest that our society stop assuming that reality shows are really anything but entertainment. Judge Judy is an entertainer the same as Jerry Springer.

 

Just because you lose your traffic ticket in court, does not mean that the judge did not listen to you. Did you ever consider that maybe you were wrong and the evidence pointed to that. Everyone who loses complains and everyone who wins thinks they are brilliant and missed their calling and should have gone to law school to become the next great Supreme Court Justice.

 

I know that like in every profession there are bad apples and yeah maybe there is a traffic "judge will almost always agree with the sworn patrolman" but it is not the rule, at least in my experience. I have had just as many dirty looks for law enforcement on my rulings as I have of the one's appearing for the citation.

 

Just another opinion.

[upflying]

Have been stopped in a marked police car by the Florida Highway Patrol.

 

That wouldn't go over to good up this way. A lesson in discretion was given several years ago, and it started when a Wisconsin State Trooper ticketed a Green Bay police officer. It wasn't long afterwards that the trooper had to ask for a peace treaty, as he was one ticket away from the last of his drivers license points and then would be unable to do his job.

Ditto on that in California. A CHP officer who stops an on-duty marked unit from an allied agency is unheard of. Word of such an incident would quickly spread around in the cyberworld of California law enforcement. Any reason for LEO driving discipline is better handled through that agencies' internal affairs or professional standards unit. The consequences of internal discipline for violation of department policy are far greater than the fine of a ticket.

Now off-duty LEO stops are a different matter. Flashing your badge is not necessarily a license to speed.

[bmwsit]

 

It's not the officer's job or responsibility to know for certain. It's the officer's job to make a judgment based on the circumstances, leaving it to the courts to make a final determination, just as in any other endeavor in which we engage law enforcement.

 

 

The problem there is that the judge will almost always agree with the sworn patrolman.

 

You are kidding, right? I can appreciate your right to your opinion and more so your right to state it, but really?

 

Maybe we should all take turns sitting as a traffic judge. I have sat as a traffic judge occasionally over the years and while I understand that everyone assumes a traffic judge is devoid of common sense and an understanding of the law, the reality is that the judge does listen to both sides and gives each the same consideration, whether the testimony is from a uniformed police officer, someone dressed in a suit, a mom there with her stroller and baby, the biker with the tattoos and braided beard, or the garage owner who shows up in his work clothes and oil stained hands. If is not an easy job. You have to listen to the evidence and then be accountable to the parties on each side that you are following the law and giving each their day in court. It is an exhausting day, and at the end of the day you spend the entire evening praying that you did the right thing in each and every case.

 

Statements such as this demonstrates a lack of understanding and appreciation of reality. I would suggest that our society stop assuming that reality shows are really anything but entertainment. Judge Judy is an entertainer the same as Jerry Springer.

 

Just because you lose your traffic ticket in court, does not mean that the judge did not listen to you. Did you ever consider that maybe you were wrong and the evidence pointed to that. Everyone who loses complains and everyone who wins thinks they are brilliant and missed their calling and should have gone to law school to become the next great Supreme Court Justice.

 

I know that like in every profession there are bad apples and yeah maybe there is a traffic "judge will almost always agree with the sworn patrolman" but it is not the rule, at least in my experience. I have had just as many dirty looks for law enforcement on my rulings as I have of the one's appearing for the citation.

 

Just another opinion.

 

I agree. I have sat through many hours of traffic court and have seen local officers and state troopers loose their cases. Most of the time by the time the officer is done testifying, the other officers in the room have already figured out the stop was FUBAR and agree with the judge when he rules not guilty. I have seen other cases that seemed good, but the judge goes with the citizen anyway after hearing why they did what they did. I have nearly always found our traffic judges to be fair to both sides. I say nearly because I have seen a few go to the extreme and rule against nearly every officer for some very odd reasons. Those usually don't last long because the presiding judge gets rid of them pretty quickly.

 

The reason most people do loose in court is because what they did was wrong. The excuse of, there was no one coming so I thought I could run the light, or no one else was on the road so I figured I could do 80 in a 55 does not fly. The officers generally know the traffic laws, know how to watch for them and what needs to be observed in order to issue the cite and be successful in court. My favorite ticket was the folks who ran the red left turn signal at major intersections. I rarely ever saw the light for their lane, but spent time documenting the cycle of lights at that intersection, knew how long it took them to cycle and the pattern. I never lost one these tickets when the people were sure they would win because I had not been behind them to see the light.

[ghaverkamp]

Word of such an incident would quickly spread around in the cyberworld of California law enforcement. Any reason for LEO driving discipline is better handled through that agencies' internal affairs or professional standards unit. The consequences of internal discipline for violation of department policy are far greater than the fine of a ticket.

 

And that's why I'm diligent about reporting each and every incident I come across in detail.

 

"Last name's B-Y-N-U-M, just passing through from Wildomar..."

 

I've never received the results of one of my reports, but I remain optimistic that they're performing as intended.

[jasonTDI]

Cameras cause more traffic wrecks than ever. It's a PROVEN FACT. The simple reason is PEOPLE control how long the yellow light is. When you drop it down from the customary 3 seconds to 1.5 you have people slamming on their brakes and then causing rear end accidents. Statistic show a 40% increase with a cut in half of the light AND a 70% increase in traffic tickets. Where does this go? To SHORTER lights, as short as .8 seconds. Accident rate doubles and ticket increase again.

 

They are also controled most of the time by PRIVATE COMPANIES that pay for them (100K an intersection) and collect MONEY EVERY TICKET WRITTEN!!!!!!!!!

Go live in your liberally controled socialist world and leave me the heck out of it.

 

 

[SWB]

An officer who routinely wrote tickets for 1 mph over the speed limit would soon be out of a job. ... In my case, my professional tolerance is 15 mph over the speed limit.

 

What I assume Bob meant but did not explicitly say (and these are my words; not trying to put words in his mouth), is that traffic enforcement has a goal in mind, and that goal is not to create mind-numbed automatons or a fearful and weary public citizenry. Unfortunately, the technology and in certain locales, the will, exists to regulate the human spirit out of existence. And individuals will always resist such tyranny.

 

Traffic enforcement is about public safety, period. It's not about revenue, or traffic cameras everywhere would make perfect sense.

 

This is one reason I reject being called a criminal for excessive speed, or speed being the primary focus of traffic enforcement. "Figures lie and liars figure" goes the saying, but while speed is almost certainly a factor in the majority of accidents, that is only so because traffic speeds are set slower than the roads are engineered for due to legal and political considerations. Almost everyone is speeding, so excessive speed is a coincidental factor in every accident, but that doesn't prove it's "the" cause.

 

With some knowledge of very old statistics, if we eliminate drugs, alcohol, and now "texting" (and other idiocies) from the mix, the accident and fatality rates drop by 50%. I'd prefer to provide our officers the means to detect impaired vehicle operation, and the courts with laws to put repeat "under-the-influence" traffic violators in jail for a very long time. A 1st chance maybe, but no 2nd chances, and for sure, the 3rd time takes a vehicle out of their hands for life (whether through technology, or prison life).

 

Beyond that, in my own subjective mind, I'd prefer an officer ticket drivers following too close, making unsafe lane changes, talking on cell phones or doing their makeup, big rigs operating unsafely, and yes, THOSE *@#%@*!#@@ DRIVERS deliberately impeding traffic flow by going 63MPH in the fast lane in a 65MPH zone, with 15 cars piled up behind them! Just once, just once in my life time, I'd like to see ONE of those idiots get tagged.

 

(Aside, and WAY off topic: I did this once, and only once, and it was stupid, but to such a driver who ignored folks going around him, ignored flashing lights, gave the "one-finger-salute" to other drivers, I gracefully passed him two lanes to his right, moved ahead of him, and then slowly dropped speed from 67mph, to 65mph, to 64, 63, 62 ... 58... 55mph. Oh boy was he pissed, flashing his lights, waving and "fingering me", and oh boy, did it make my day. He finally pulled over to the right, and I went on my way.)

 

Finally, Bob, we appreciate your service, and all the guys out there keeping us safe.

 

Regards,

 

Scott