Works Performance Shocks - The long and the short of it.

[Twisties]

Prior history

 

I had said I'd get back to ya'll after the rebuilt Works Performance shocks arrived. They showed up yesterday and have been installed on both bikes.

 

The hydraulic line for the external pre-load adjusters have proved to be configured incorrectly. The net effect is that they are too short, though really it's more a matter of using a 90 degree angle banjo bolt instead of a straight one. The adjusters will sit loose on the bike wrapped in a towel until riding season ends and we can ship the shocks back yet again.

 

Additionally, they still don't have the weight range right. The shop was able to set sag correctly for Sharon at full touring load, with the adjustment set to full soft. They could not achieve enough sag with her lightly loaded. Mine appear to be in range, but will be close on the loaded end. We'll see this weekend as they get a little workout on the way to Torrey.

 

We are now told, for the first time, that these are the first of a new model, and Works is just getting dialed in. Gee thanks. I'll say at this point that I am utterly disgusted w/Works. YMMV.

 

The local shop remains cooperative and will continue to do free labor until this is done right. No complaints there. In fact kudo's to Motorcycle R&R.

 

I have confirmed that the only user adjustments are the pre-load on the front, and the pre-load and rebound damping on the rear. The springs are single rate. The shocks are gas emulsion.

 

Initial (very initial) riding impression 20 miles city streets and urban interstate w/a couple of nice ramps for sweepers...

 

The shocks seem to perform as Russell describes: More comfy over bumps yet able to maintain a more stable chassis under riding conditions.

 

Time will tell.

[smiller]

Well sorry to hear of all the troubles Jan. But thanks for helping to get all the bugs worked out for the rest of us...

[Fugu]

At least Sharon's bike has working hand warmers!

 

 

*ducking*

 

 

 

 

 

[marcopolo]

Jan, see my reply of today in Hexheads in the thread on aftremarket shocks. I just had Ohlins installed at the MOA rally this morning. Very professional job. Sorry to hear about your hassles.

[hopz]

Thank you for the update. Thanks also to Motorcycle Repair and Rendezvous for their skill and willingness to work on the problem.

 

I think works should step up and compensate all of you in some way... you, Sharon and MR&R. It is not right to be their test bed without telling you.

[Twisties]

Oh my though, Fairview/Huntington Canyon was really something... nearly perfect road surface, no traffic, and for the first time ever I really didn't feel hampered by a light touring load. The load was maybe a little less than half what I specified for full load, so not a complete test, but the ride remained comfy and the chassis was nearly completely stable. It was time to run....

[Bill_Walker]

Any chance they got Sharon's shocks and your shocks on the wrong bikes?

[Twisties]

Nothing would surprise me at this point. We'll get Sharon's bike home Tuesday and see what we can tell.

[ESokoloff]

Nothing would surprise me at this point.........

 

Did you know that they are DOWN WIND?

[Firefight911]

I certainly hope you have forwarded this link direct to Works!!

[Twisties]

Nothing would surprise me at this point.........

 

Did you know that they are DOWN WIND?

 

No, now I understand. Hmmm, but isn't Ohlin downwind of Chernobyl?

 

[Twisties]

Any chance they got Sharon's shocks and your shocks on the wrong bikes?

 

Wow!!!!! Just rode Sharon's bike home from the shop (we went in for set-up Thursday morning, but left it there for logistical reasons). This is the first time either of us have been on it with the rebuilt shocks.

 

Now why did I call this thread "The long and short of it" you may have wondered. I forgot to pick back up on that thought in the OP, and it hadn't come up until now. On the original build, Sharons' shocks were lowered an 1", and mine were to be stock length. The long ones and the short ones. Back on the original build one of the things I initially suspected was that my weight specs got used on the short shocks and Sharon's weight specs got used on the long ones. That theory blew apart, apparently, when it was determined that Sharon's shocks were too soft too, even for her.

 

Now, my shocks are riding comfortably, if anything, too soft, and despite my original assessment, with more saddle time, I'm thinking my bike is a bit loose. Although, frankly, at some point I guess it's a matter of rider skill to maintain a smooth ride vs the shocks ability to absorb inputs.

 

Sharon's on the other hand, wow, what a difference. The ride is very harsh and firm. At first I thought this is because I weigh more, and over compressed the suspension. That shouldn't happen because her weight plus the specified luggage load just about equals my weight, I'm a touch under. I measured the front sag when I got home and found it was a mere 3/4" with my weight. I couldn't measure rear sag by myself, but my impression is that it is pretty stiff too.

 

Now I wonder if they switched the weight specs this time around? I'm tempted to run Sharon's bike up the canyon so I can get a better feel for what the suspension is doing.

 

I'm just astounded at the difference between these two bikes, and really curious to see how this suspension feels to Sharon.

 

In any event, it is clear that the shortened shocks are on Sharon's bike, and the stock length shocks are on mine.

 

Not to overly complicate matters, they were supposed to cut a half inch off mine on the rebuild, but I don't think it happened. Certainly the shock bodies on Sharon's are a full inch shorter than mine.

[DavidEBSmith]

I always thought the Works shocks for my RT were way too firm and harsh. I had them rebuilt twice (for wear and tear) and complained about it and they always came back the same.

[smiller]

I always thought the Works shocks for my RT were way too firm and harsh. I had them rebuilt twice (for wear and tear) and complained about it and they always came back the same.

I felt the same way (not way too firm, but more than I wanted) and asked Works to lower the high-speed compression damping, which they did (free of charge since I was having the shocks rebuilt anyway.) Made all the difference in the world, nearly spot-on to my preference afterwards. I believe I remember Russell saying that he had a similar experience. Works should have suggested this to you if you were complaining of harshness.

[Matts_12GS]

man, this is driving me crazy waiting for the ending here.

I have works shocks on my 1100rt and I'm shopping shocks for the GS....

 

 

[Paul Mihalka]

Matt, if you think Wilbers, check out www.beemershop.com /Ted Porter. I got my shocks from him. I know him well, we worked together for a few years at Bob's BMW. He knows his stuff. Advrider guys rave about him, and there is not one bad comment, which is rare.

[Matts_12GS]

Thanks Paul!

One of our local club guys was just telling me about Day Kyle at Kyle Racing. He quoted me prices for Ohlins at pretty much the same price as Wilbers, and cheaper than the HyperPro.

 

Decision time I think, hopefully I will have them for KY in October.

[Fugu]

I'd second Ted Porter and Wilbers.

 

I've had Ohlins on a GS and on my 04 RT.

 

My buddy (who is the same size as me) had Ted Porter build him Wilbers for his 02 and they are markedly better than my Ohlins on either bike.

 

 

Sorry for the continued Hijack Jan. Figure out who's shocks are who's will ya?

 

[russell_bynum]

Thanks Paul!

One of our local club guys was just telling me about Day Kyle at Kyle Racing. He quoted me prices for Ohlins at pretty much the same price as Wilbers, and cheaper than the HyperPro.

 

Decision time I think, hopefully I will have them for KY in October.

 

Dan Kyle does first-rate work.

[Firefight911]

Thanks Paul!

One of our local club guys was just telling me about Day Kyle at Kyle Racing. He quoted me prices for Ohlins at pretty much the same price as Wilbers, and cheaper than the HyperPro.

 

Decision time I think, hopefully I will have them for KY in October.

 

Dan Kyle does first-rate work.

 

And yet more hijacking! Dan Kyle is fantastic.

[Twisties]

I always thought the Works shocks for my RT were way too firm and harsh. I had them rebuilt twice (for wear and tear) and complained about it and they always came back the same.

I felt the same way (not way to firm, but more than I wanted) and asked Works to lower the high-speed compression damping, which they did (free of charge since I was having the shocks rebuilt anyway.) Made all the difference in the world, nearly spot-on to my preference afterwards. I believe I remember Russell saying that he had a similar experience. Works should have suggested this to you if you were complaining of harshness.

 

I guess I wasn't really clear, but my point was, or at least my thinking, if I failed to make the point, that if the lighter rider's (115 lbs plus up to 120 lbs luggage) shocks come in significantly stiffer than the heavier rider's (225 lbs plus up to 140 lbs luggage) shocks it doesn't sound like merely a "dialing in" of a new design issue. And they are very significantly stiffer.

 

Whether that is the result of a miscommunication between the shop and Works, a total screw-up at Works, or some combination, I'm not buying the new design thing so much anymore, and am leaning more towards Bill's point, at least in so far at the internals go.

 

Meanwhile, this just in, the shop has talked to Works and found that they can still adjust the threaded adjuster on the shock body, in addition to using the hydraulic adjuster. So the bike needs to be run back in to see if the situation can be improved.

 

The saga continues.

[russell_bynum]

I always thought the Works shocks for my RT were way too firm and harsh. I had them rebuilt twice (for wear and tear) and complained about it and they always came back the same.

I felt the same way (not way too firm, but more than I wanted) and asked Works to lower the high-speed compression damping, which they did (free of charge since I was having the shocks rebuilt anyway.) Made all the difference in the world, nearly spot-on to my preference afterwards. I believe I remember Russell saying that he had a similar experience. Works should have suggested this to you if you were complaining of harshness.

 

Correct. Like you said...it was just a bit harsh over the sharp bumps. i.e. Too much HSCD. I spoke to Works when I sent my shocks in for the first rebuild and suggested that they remove a bit of HSCD. The shocks came back pretty much perfect.

 

 

[hopz]

The saga continues.

 

Great Pun Jan...

 

We are all looking forward to hearing they got it all figured out. Shocking how they are taking so long...

[Bernie]

I always thought the Works shocks for my RT were way too firm and harsh. I had them rebuilt twice (for wear and tear) and complained about it and they always came back the same.

I felt the same way (not way to firm, but more than I wanted) and asked Works to lower the high-speed compression damping, which they did (free of charge since I was having the shocks rebuilt anyway.) Made all the difference in the world, nearly spot-on to my preference after wards. I believe I remember Russell saying that he had a similar experience. Works should have suggested this to you if you were complaining of harshness.

 

I guess I wasn't really clear, but my point was, or at least my thinking, if I failed to make the point, that if the lighter rider's (115 lbs plus up to 120 lbs luggage) shocks come in significantly stiffer than the heavier rider's (225 lbs plus up to 140 lbs luggage) shocks it doesn't sound like merely a "dialing in" of a new design issue. And they are very significantly stiffer.

 

Whether that is the result of a miscommunication between the shop and Works, a total screw-up at Works, or some combination, I'm not buying the new design thing so much anymore, and am leaning more towards Bill's point, at least in so far at the internals go.

 

Meanwhile, this just in, the shop has talked to Works and found that they can still adjust the threaded adjuster on the shock body, in addition to using the hydraulic adjuster. So the bike needs to be run back in to see if the situation can be improved.

 

The saga continues.

The treated adjuster, sets the beginning setting of the preload adjuster.

Since you wanted your bike lowered by 1/2 inch, they may have done what a another shock builder did for a friend of mine. They supplied him with a softer spring which lowers the bike a 1/2 inch or more , due to the weight of the bike.

Also they may have the rebound damping set to high on Sharon's bike and to soft on yours.

[Twisties]

I always thought the Works shocks for my RT were way too firm and harsh. I had them rebuilt twice (for wear and tear) and complained about it and they always came back the same.

I felt the same way (not way to firm, but more than I wanted) and asked Works to lower the high-speed compression damping, which they did (free of charge since I was having the shocks rebuilt anyway.) Made all the difference in the world, nearly spot-on to my preference after wards. I believe I remember Russell saying that he had a similar experience. Works should have suggested this to you if you were complaining of harshness.

 

I guess I wasn't really clear, but my point was, or at least my thinking, if I failed to make the point, that if the lighter rider's (115 lbs plus up to 120 lbs luggage) shocks come in significantly stiffer than the heavier rider's (225 lbs plus up to 140 lbs luggage) shocks it doesn't sound like merely a "dialing in" of a new design issue. And they are very significantly stiffer.

 

Whether that is the result of a miscommunication between the shop and Works, a total screw-up at Works, or some combination, I'm not buying the new design thing so much anymore, and am leaning more towards Bill's point, at least in so far at the internals go.

 

Meanwhile, this just in, the shop has talked to Works and found that they can still adjust the threaded adjuster on the shock body, in addition to using the hydraulic adjuster. So the bike needs to be run back in to see if the situation can be improved.

 

The saga continues.

 

 

The treated adjuster, sets the beginning setting of the preload adjuster.

 

You may well be right, or partially right anyway.

 

 

Yes, Ron talked to the engineer and found that the threaded adjuster sets a base pre-load, and then the hydraulic adjuster can be used to fine tune to a range of about 1/4 the entire adjustability range. Apparently, when the new design shocks came in he wasn't sure if the factory allowed user adjustment of the threads still, or if that would mess something up.

 

I took Sharon's bike in today and Ron lowered the rear pre-load threaded adjuster, and then played with the hydraulic adjuster and dampening. He dramatically reduced the dampening. Also lowered the front pre-load about 20%. Ron thinks Sharon's shocks are now in proper adjustment. They are certainly much better than they were. He gave her detailed settings for loaded and unloaded. We'll get Sharon out on them ASAP.

 

Regarding my bike:

 

Since you wanted your bike lowered by 1/2 inch, they may have done what a another shock builder did for a friend of mine. They supplied him with a softer spring which lowers the bike a 1/2 inch or more , due to the weight of the bike.

 

Actually I wanted a standard ride height bike. The purpose of the rebuild was to correct an initially over soft spring. The bike was riding higher than stock due to my having maxed out the pre-load on the soft spring. Ron thought, and number of BMWST'ers agreed, that the rebuilt shocks would also likely ride a bit high. The 1/2" was an attempt to account for that. In any event, the purpose of the rebuild was to beef up the suspension which was grossly under sprung. So hopefully they did not take that approach. The bike is definitely not riding any lower than stock, and I am happy with the ride height, in any event... though we'll see after the suspension is dialed in correctly.

 

In any event, having witnessed Ron's adjustment procedures, I'm going to give it a shot at adjustment on my bike tonight myself when it cools off a bit. I think it will be able to be brought in range. It is only somewhat soft. I'm thinking 20%-30% more preload on the threaded adjuster (since the hydraulic is now set to max) should put me in the range where the hydraulic adjuster will be useful. Maybe one or two clicks more damping.

 

The shocks will still need to go back a third time (second time?.. original build, rebuild, and once more coming up) for the hydraulic line fix. If we need any further adjustment of the build it sounds like they will do it then. In the meantime we should have something rideable for the rest of the summer.

[Twisties]

The saga continues.

 

Great Pun Jan...

 

We are all looking forward to hearing they got it all figured out. Shocking how they are taking so long...

 

It's been two days and it still hasn't come to me. Sometimes you need to bludgeon me. What's the pun?

[Bernie]

I had to also adjust the preload cylinder on my Wilbur's shocks for my R1100RT. After trying the factory settings, I started dialing preload until it would feel good, then I called Klaus and asked him how many turns I would have to turn it. He said I could return it, but it was very easy to do with a large vise and a large pair of channel locks. If you know how preload you have to dial in to raise it, then they can look on there chart and tell you how many turns to adjust the collar to get your base settings.