Blue Tooth Helmet to Autocom (best of both worlds)

[dhanson]

Linky

 

Has anyone done this yet?

[marcopolo]

I talked to the Autocom guys about it at this year's MOA Rally, but discovered I'd have to buy two (one for me and one for my wife). I have an Autocom on the bike, but bought Sena Bluetooth headsets for both of us earlier this year. They work fine as a rider-passemger intercom, but I no longer have GPS audio (my GPS is not Bluetooth-capable and is hard wired to my Autocom hub). I was looking for a Bluetooth dongle of sorts that would allow me to hear GPS audio in my Sena headset. When I asked about this new Autocom module, I was told that, while I'd be able to hear my GPS through my Sena headset, I would no longer be able to hear my wife unless we got a second Autocom Bluetooth module. Assuming I understood then correctly, I concluded that was too much to pay to solve that problem. I'm now thinking about a new Sena module that has just now gone on sale; only problem is that it is battery powered.

[Rougarou]

This may work better for you. I do not have one, but my intent is to get one.

 

[John Bentall]

I imagine that you are, like of lot of other folk, basically very happy with the Sena headsets.

 

Below is a link to a selection of bluetooth transmitters that you can plug in to the 3.5mm output of the GPS and then pair with your headset. Of course the transmitter is battery powered!

 

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_c_2_15?url=search-alias%3Dautomotive&field-keywords=bluetooth+transmitter&sprefix=Bluetooth+trans

 

I have a motorcycle and a scooter (for commuting 20 miles each way) and both are equipped with Autocom units and bike-to-bike radio, so I am still firmly wedded to the concept of wires.I cannot cope with the idea of all these battery-powered devices.

[Autocom Matt]

The SR10 will not handle rider-passenger. It is what Sena say's... "Bluetooth two-way radio adapter". Although it will also combine a radar/mono gps signal, it will not allow you to talk with your wife and simultaneously hear a navigation prompt like you can with a hard wired system. The benefit of the Wire3a is that it allows the Sena to use just one device solving most of the issues with Bluetooth.

[Autocom Matt]

This may work better for you. I do not have one, but my intent is to get one.

 

 

Limited stereo audio. Intercom is not simultaneous with things like radar and GPS voice prompts.

[KDeline]

This may work better for you. I do not have one, but my intent is to get one.

 

 

Limited stereo audio. Intercom is not simultaneous with things like radar and GPS voice prompts.

 

Like all the other communication systems out there, so close.........But they all have some flaw.

[marcopolo]

The SR10 will not handle rider-passenger. It is what Sena say's... "Bluetooth two-way radio adapter". Although it will also combine a radar/mono gps signal, it will not allow you to talk with your wife and simultaneously hear a navigation prompt like you can with a hard wired system. The benefit of the Wire3a is that it allows the Sena to use just one device solving most of the issues with Bluetooth.

 

Are you saying that even if my wife and I use our Sena headsets to talk to each other that we'd need only one Autocom Bluetooth module for me to get GPS audio prompts? If I pair my Sena headset to this Autocom module, how do I communicate with my wife's Sena headset? Recognizing I may have misunderstood the Autocom guys at the MOA Rally, I thought I'd have to buy two Autocom modules to: a) hear GPS audio prompts (GPS wired to my Autocom hub), and b) speak to my wife on our Sena headsets.

[John Bentall]

Isn't adding an Autocom Wire3A solution to existing sophisticated Sena Comms like locking the stable door after the horse has bolted.

The beauty of the Wire3A is that it will link to any inexpensive BT head set around the $40-50 mark, replacing the Autocom dumb headset.

 

So, for intercom functionality, you would buy an Autocom hub, BT headset(s)of your choice, Wire3A(s) and NO Autocom headset(s).

 

Having said that it would be worth someone trying to pair the Autocom Wire3A device as a Sena "Intercom Friend". However the rider has to initiate any intercom conversation by pressing the jog dial.

 

A scenario might be Rider connected to Wire3A as First Intercom friend receiving GPS instructions & paired to pillion as second Intercom Friend. Rider talks to pillion by pressing jog dial twice & Pillion talks to rider paired as First Intercom friend using VOX capability (automatic speech by saying a word loudly).

 

Who will be the first to test this method out?

 

John

[marcopolo]

Isn't adding an Autocom Wire3A solution to existing sophisticated Sena Comms like locking the stable door after the horse has bolted...

 

Not in my case I don't think. I've had my Autocom since 2007, whereas I just bought the Sena headsets six months ago (they were not particularly expensive). My wife was sick of plugging in the cord, so when it was time to buy new helmets, we decided we'd cut the cord, so to speak. The Autocom, of course, is still installed on the bike. I was simply trying to find an easy -- and inexpensive -- way to regain the GPS audio which I had enjoyed when using the Autocom. My GPS is not Bluetooth capable (Garmin 276C), and if I update my GPS, it's probably not going to be either (Garmin Montana). Both, however, have 3.5mm audio out.

[bobbybob]

After viewing the "connection guide"-->> http://www.senabluetooth.com/support/connection_guide.php?tab_menu=sr10

this thing appears to be very close to a complete wireless replacement for the Autocom. In fact, if you don't need rider-to-passenger intercom, it pretty much fills the bill already. I am interested.

 

 

 

[johnlt]

After viewing the "connection guide"-->> http://www.senabluetooth.com/support/connection_guide.php?tab_menu=sr10

this thing appears to be very close to a complete wireless replacement for the Autocom. In fact, if you don't need rider-to-passenger intercom, it pretty much fills the bill already. I am interested.

 

 

 

Bob, it looks like there is an "or" between the radar detector and GPS. Does that mean you can't have both? Also, I'm assuming if you can interface with the GPS like a Zumo 550, that includes "all" functionality of the unit including XM, MP3 and GPS voice. Is that the way you read it?

 

I think we're close but probably a year or so away of the complete system I want. I want all the functionality of my wired system with good quiality stereo sound (I don't need intercom)AND, at least 12 hours headset battery life.

[Autocom Matt]

"If I pair my Sena headset to this Autocom module, how do I communicate with my wife's Sena headset?"

 

For you to hear prompts you could pair Autocom to one headset and then rider passenger through the Sena. She would not be able to hear Autocom. Sena's "smart-ness" would not blend both sources but rather connect to either wife or GPS one at a time.

 

To blend audio sources intelligently you would have to pair to some kind of hub. Currently the only one's I'm aware of using this method is Autocom/Starcom's Wire3a module (2 of them + system) or the J&M system (bust out the razor knife).

[Autocom Matt]

After viewing the "connection guide"-->> http://www.senabluetooth.com/support/connection_guide.php?tab_menu=sr10

this thing appears to be very close to a complete wireless replacement for the Autocom. In fact, if you don't need rider-to-passenger intercom, it pretty much fills the bill already. I am interested.

 

Check for stereo... It is so close and hopefully the next iteration will provide the following features:

 

* Stereo wired audio and microphone for Zumo

* Bluetooth A2DP and Headset profile for wireless Zumo or smartphone

* Rider and Passenger pairing

 

How much would you'll pay for a device which did this? It would have to be more as you doubled the component cost of the board.

 

For the SR10 to work best it needs to be the only device paired to the Sena. Note the selected pairing on the diagram. This means that while listening to your A2DP MP3 player paired directly you don't have radar alert. Also, the phone uses the headset profile not A2DP so no stereo music and poor bitrate.

[Autocom Matt]

After viewing the "connection guide"-->> http://www.senabluetooth.com/support/connection_guide.php?tab_menu=sr10

this thing appears to be very close to a complete wireless replacement for the Autocom.

 

That is like saying a skateboard is a replacement to a motorcycle because they will both roll down the road

 

Seriously, an Autocom, Starcom, and even J&M do much more. Unfortunately like other poster said, none are perfect and they all have a major pitfall. So picking the best one for your needs can be hard.

 

My advice for a solo rider:

 

If you don't need bike-to-bike, just pair to a Zumo 660/665 and use a good, hard wired radar alert light and siren such as a Screamer. If you have cell service you can still call your ride partners through a phone paired to the Zumo. Your music would be in stereo and life could should be happy.

 

Bluetooth headsets could serve as a grown-up communication system but they would be huge and batteries would be even more huge! Sena made a great step in the right direction and I'm eagerly watching where they take the product.

 

A system which would obsolete the analog Autocom systems, the Starcom1 half digital product, and the Sena SR10 is within very much within current technology. The problem comes from the fact that we are a relatively small market. Someone bringing a solution that would wrap up all the short comings and offer much more such as:

* Every input/output to be Bluetooth or analog

* Firmware upgrade-able DSP for active noise cancellation and configuration

* User programmable muting priorities and levels

would spend approximately $100,000 in engineering and first low volume production run. After that, you are looking at a product which would need to retail for almost $600 to be an Autocom/Starcom/J&M/Sena SR10 killer. How many of you would pay that?

 

Now if only someone would offer a hack for the Zumo firmware to monitor microphone connection through system mix allowing a radar to hook to Zumo microphone and audio to be consequently sent out analog and Bluetooth.

[Kritou]

After reading all this I don't understand why Autocom have not produced a Class 1 BT plug and play dongle for B2B. There certainly seems the market for a short range, one to one (or more?), duplex comms system that works out of the box with their wired systems - including their legacy ones

[Autocom Matt]

Not speaking for Autocom, but these would be my reasons not to...

 

Range is still mediocre compared to a proper GMRS radio. I'm not comparing Bluetooth to toy radios, but rather well built GMRS units. Any kind of UHF signal is mainly limited by antenna height. At least with a real GMRS radio you can do something a little about it.

 

Multiple parties can't be handled by a single Bluetooth radio. The devices would have to be paired and establish a connection. Such a process involves priority and doesn't allow one rider to speak and 3 to hear.

 

Bluetooth by itself has latency issues with audio. This has been improving and for bike to bike use the HSP profile is fine. Less of a concern, but still worth mentioning.

 

Most importantly... it would be a product to connect a couple of Autocoms, probably Starcoms as well. It would not interop with Cardo or Sena intercoms.

 

With all the good and bad, one could be whipped up as a long weekend project. To be compatible with a Scala or Sena one would have to become a donor. You could also use an already licensed Class 1 module and roll your own, but you'd need to make a PCB and be patient enough for some SMC work.

[John Bentall]

Kritou, I remembered your question clearly and put it to the Autocom guys at the NEC show in November.

They are not "I am going to bury my head in the stand"-stupid. They buy off-the-shelf bluetooth systems from the competition and test them out. Basically the Autocom development staff feel that the available bluetooth performance is not up to the standard achievable with radios, nor what people expect from an Autocom system nor what they want to offer from an Autocom system.

I am not saying the the BT bike-to-bike systems don't work nor that they don't keep a lot of customers perfectly happy. Shall we settle for "they are not up to professional standard"?

I hope Starcom/Autocom are treading the right path on this issue as I would like to see them prosper well into the future.

 

Regards,

 

John

[Kritou]

John, I also put the question to Autocom at the NEC and their answer was production cost/return and other priorities

 

Although I now have a good PMR/dipole antenna system that works with my Autocom the hassle of screening, powering, isolating, wiring and the inevitable RF breakthrough from other sources makes me wish for a short range duplex comms capability when riding with a companion biker