WarmnSafe: New heated gear controller

[markgoodrich]

I've always wanted to be able to control my gloves and jacket independently, but didn't like the "velcro it to the top of the clutch reservoir, or whatever" dual controller they make. Nor did I really want to have to mess with yet another wire every time I stop...I already have Autocom, earphones, lose my keys....

 

WarmnSafe has a new product (turns out I have SN 3) which uses invisible radio magic to control the gloves and jacket with two separate, mounted controllers (knobs). I drilled holes in my RT's radio blank on the left side of the fairing upper, and cut out some of the supporting plastic underneath, and by some miracle managed to get everything right. Two knobs, two LEDs, just where I wanted them. The rest of the controller unit is under the left fairing upper, with power leads back to the battery.

 

Then, the jacket (they have a trade-in policy which I took advantage of and got the latest model) gets another little magic box which fits in a little pocket, and has coax plugs for the glove circuit and the jacket circuit. There's just one plug from the jacket to the bike, just as with a single controller. The "knobs" somehow magically communicate with the jacket box, and the heat goes up or down, independently, to jacket and gloves. Very nifty. If you have First Gear heated stuff, it's made by WarmnSafe. This product is so new it's not on their website yet, but you can order it...call 'em. the trade-in deal is significantly less than list.

 

I'll try to post photos tomorrow.

 

Let's see, this should elicit at the very least, the following types of posts:

 

1. "Gerbings are better." [might be, never tried 'em]

2. "If it ain't hard wahred it ain't gonna work/last/be worth a...."

3. "Why, I ain't never seen the need for 'lectric nuthin', and I live in a igloo in Alaska. Naked."

4. "I have a BMW vest and it is the only thing I would ever use because it says BMW on it."

 

 

[ESokoloff]

I've always wanted to be able to control my gloves and jacket independently,..... and by some miracle managed to get everything right. Two knobs, two LEDs,

 

 

Kinda reminds me of a story on older couple told of their electric blanket experiences.

 

They had a newfangled duel controlled his/hers setup.

The first night it gave them fits.

In the middle of the night she awoke freezing & cranked her side up.

Sometime latter he awoke roasting & turned his side down.

This went on for the rest of the night & by morning they realized they crossed the controls.

[moshe_levy]

Mark-

 

Sounds like all this is is a permanent-mount version of the Remote Heat-Troller like the one I tested for MCN last year - see http://www.mklsportster.com/Articles/mcnwarmnsafe.pdf - it's always worked perfectly. I like that one and the EXO model for perma-mount. If I had to choose a W&S vs. EXO for perma-mount, the EXO would win hands down for looking the part and being far more ergonomic to use vs. the knobs on W&S. All Gerbing's and the standard W&S wired controllers are, by comparison, absolutely horrendous from a motorcyclist's ergonomic point of view. This will draw posts from riders who are happy with theirs - fine. I bet you haven't tried anything else to compare it to. I was using those old controllers for 10 years before my MCN test and never had a problem - until I tried something better, and now I'll never go back.

 

Personally I like the idea of the W&S remote controller more than permanent, since I can move it with me from bike to bike (just keep it in the tank bag or whatever). But the "wireless magic" is definitely cool and it does work well indeed. My battery lasted 2 seasons - twice what they said it would.

 

As I discovered during my testing of cold weather gear for MCN and have been repeating ad nauseum here, people spend 99% of their time agonizing over which brand of liner or gloves to buy, when in fact there is very little difference in performance, fit, or quality from the major well known brands. There are exceptions (like Tourmaster, which took longer to get much cooler peak temps overall vs. Gerbing's, W&S, Aerostich, et. al.), but those who have read my tests have seen the lab reports that show the heat levels and duration of time it took to achieve them. Advertising hype aside - very little difference.

 

But those little controllers - where we're actually going to be interfacing with the product on a daily basis - nobody spends any time thinking about. That started to change recently with the advent of EXO's excellent controller, and W&S's fantastic remote / wireless setup. To me that says somebody is finally thinking "How would a motorcyclist wearing gloves mount this? How does it feel to use it while riding? How easy is it to see and feel the various settings?" - rather than "this is an after thought" which is what most controllers actually feel like when you've had the good fortune to try one that's any good.

 

To that end I welcome the death knell of the old-fashioned wired controllers with tiny knobs and no markings, no detents, and no provisions to mount other than some home-made velcro contraption that generally looks and feels like motorcycle mounting wasn't a firs priority. There is certainly room for improvement there and more customers should pay attention to that, and drive the change required from the manufacturers to bring those products up to snuff. EXO and W&S are listening. Soon others will also, I'd say.

 

-MKL

[markgoodrich]

I forgot to predict that "Moshe Levy will write many, many words about this product."

 

All true, I might add, regarding the WarmnSafe stuff...dunno EXO from ELO (get it? didja get it? huh? didja?)

 

Knobs are fine with me, through the gloves, no problem.

[moshe_levy]

W&S knobs are at least marked, unlike Gerbing's. I forgot if my remote controller has detents, but I think it does, unlike Gerbing's. I mean, this is elementary stuff - imagine a controller with no markings and no detents on its teeny-tiny knobs, and you're now at speed trying to adjust it with winter gloves on. Really - an after-thought, as I said.

 

Knobs are OK, Mark, but compared to a nice big 0.5" LCD display with an equally large button that lets me toggle 0-9, they're simply outclassed.

 

 

So simple and easy to use, it's truly a wonder nobody thought of it sooner. Icing on the cake was the EXO (at the time - haven't checked recently) was much less than the price of W&S or Gerbing's. For dual control buy two EXOs - still less money than dual-control from either W&S or Gerbing's. And it has a nice metal mounting plate included that looks OEM. No bullshit velcro home-made mounting. Hasn't skipped a beat on my bike - I like it so much I bought my test sample. So I use that on the RT and I use the W&S Remote on my other bikes. Both are great. I hope someday EXO makes a true dual controller. That would be perfect!

 

-MKL

[CoarsegoldKid]

My W&S remote controller does not have detents. But it does have a line on the knob so I have some visual info. I don't like that I must have a small screwdriver to remove tiny screws to access the battery however. Also if the battery dies the liner still receives 1/3 the current so it can still provide some heat. On the down side when it is turned off it still provides 1/3 current and heat. Unplugging is the only real off switch.

[RockBottom]

Cable ties work better than velcro.

 

[moshe_levy]

That's wierd. Why is my picture link of the EXO not showing up now? It worked before.... Let's try again: Some shots:

 

A decent shot is here in Webbikeworld's test but for some reason it just won't display here - see http://www.webbikeworld.com/r3/heated-vest/exo-storm-rider/

 

Here are some other shots, though quite poor. It's all I could find out there on Google.

 

 

 

Hopefully some of these will work. Most of the online shots I see are crappy indeed. If you go to the 5th page of my MCN test http://www.mklsportster.com/Articles/mcnheatedgear.pdf you can see a pic of the EXO mounted to my old RT.

 

I never heard of EXO before the editors sent me their stuff, and I'm usually pretty good re knowing what's out there for us to use. That company has some marketing to do, but the product - what counts - is solid.

 

-MKL

[tallman]

Whatever you do, don't try to connect via bluetooth with

the remote controller running your heated gear.

You can set your helmet on fire.

 

[markgoodrich]

Whatever you do, don't try to connect via bluetooth with

the remote controller running your heated gear.

You can set your helmet on fire.

 

Could happen to anyone.

 

[markgoodrich]

That's wierd. Why is my picture link of the EXO not showing up now? It worked before.... Let's try again: Some shots:

 

A decent shot is here in Webbikeworld's test but for some reason it just won't display here - see http://www.webbikeworld.com/r3/heated-vest/exo-storm-rider/

 

Here are some other shots, though quite poor. It's all I could find out there on Google.

 

 

 

Hopefully some of these will work. Most of the online shots I see are crappy indeed. If you go to the 5th page of my MCN test http://www.mklsportster.com/Articles/mcnheatedgear.pdf you can see a pic of the EXO mounted to my old RT.

 

I never heard of EXO before the editors sent me their stuff, and I'm usually pretty good re knowing what's out there for us to use. That company has some marketing to do, but the product - what counts - is solid.

 

-MKL

 

I also forgot to predict

 

"My EXO is better."

[markgoodrich]

Okay, here are clickable thumbnails of the remote controller and the way I installed it on the bike. The third knob is the Amplirider volume control. The LEDs light up when the unit is turned on, then go off, and blink once every minute or so. Not at all distracting. If you leave them on when you get off the bike, assuming you disconnect your jacket, the draw is so small you have no worries about draining your bike battery.

 

A separate lead, not shown, runs from the battery to the coax plug shown.

 

[Smoky]

I have the EXO controler for my W&S liner. It's a great combination.

 

My wife uses the Gerbings thin-wire liner, and their controller, also a great bit of kit.

[EddyQ]

Okay, here are clickable thumbnails of the remote controller and the way I installed it on the bike. The third knob is the Amplirider volume control. The LEDs light up when the unit is turned on, then go off, and blink once every minute or so. Not at all distracting. If you leave them on when you get off the bike, assuming you disconnect your jacket, the draw is so small you have no worries about draining your bike battery.

 

Nice job Mark!

 

I recently got the W&S version with the battery. I used 3M Dual-Lock, which seriously kicks butt out of velcro for holding such a thing.

A negative to your setup is if you switch often to other bikes and don't want to buy another controller.

 

The only issue I have with my remote is that when power is removed from the receiver in the jacket liner, you NEED to cycle power on the controller by turning the knobs CCW til they click and then turn them back. So, if you step off your bike while getting gas or have an intermittent connection to the jacket, you need to fuss with the controller to get proper heat again. Do you have this issue?

 

It does power up in a 1/3 power state. So, if you totally loose the controller (in my case the battery may die), you still get 1/3 power. Naturally, if you need full power you could jumper the whole thing if really in a cold situation.

[markgoodrich]

Very interesting, about having to off/on the transceiver. Not a big deal, but unexpected.

 

Some of us can't afford more than one bike, Eddy.

[EddyQ]

Some of us can't afford more than one bike, Eddy.

 

Yeh, I know. I only have the one bike.

[moshe_levy]

Ed, I'd contact W&S on that cycling issue. I don't believe it's supposed to do that. Per my lit received with my test sample, quoting from my article based on the info I got from W&S and tested personally:

 

"The controller and receiver are very easy to synch together to allow communication. The process involves turning the controller on and off quickly 3 times, and then plugging the receiver to power within 10 seconds. Once synched, you never have to do it again. "

 

-MKL

[markgoodrich]

Ed, I'd contact W&S on that cycling issue. I don't believe it's supposed to do that. Per my lit received with my test sample, quoting from my article based on the info I got from W&S and tested personally:

 

"The controller and receiver are very easy to synch together to allow communication. The process involves turning the controller on and off quickly 3 times, and then plugging the receiver to power within 10 seconds. Once synched, you never have to do it again. "

 

The instructions for my unit state it is already synced...I did not have to do so. That may or may not have something to do with the fact that mine is bike powered, with no battery in the transceiver. I'll probably have a chance to test it this weekend.

 

-MKL

[moshe_levy]

Oh, right. I'm talking here strictly of the remote unit I tested. Can't speak for others...

 

-MKL

[Nice n Easy Rider]

The only issue I have with my remote is that when power is removed from the receiver in the jacket liner, you NEED to cycle power on the controller by turning the knobs CCW til they click and then turn them back. So, if you step off your bike while getting gas or have an intermittent connection to the jacket, you need to fuss with the controller to get proper heat again. Do you have this issue?

I've found the same thing with my W & S controller: have to turn it all the way CCW and then back to the setting I want to get the heat I'm looking for. Not a big deal - if I get going and don't notice the heat i just reach over and reset it then. Heat comes on pretty fast.

[markgoodrich]

The only issue I have with my remote is that when power is removed from the receiver in the jacket liner, you NEED to cycle power on the controller by turning the knobs CCW til they click and then turn them back. So, if you step off your bike while getting gas or have an intermittent connection to the jacket, you need to fuss with the controller to get proper heat again. Do you have this issue?

I've found the same thing with my W & S controller: have to turn it all the way CCW and then back to the setting I want to get the heat I'm looking for. Not a big deal - if I get going and don't notice the heat i just reach over and reset it then. Heat comes on pretty fast.

 

 

Here's why, according to the W&S owner, Mike Coan: if you have the battery powered version, the transceiver shuts down after 1.5 minutes to preserver the little battery. The bike-powered unit doesn't shut down for 70 minutes after the apparel is disconnected.

[markgoodrich]

Once again I am replying to myself. Coan asked me to post the following email response:

 

I am trying to log on but it seems I had to register and it still has not approved the registration. I thought I joined before since I have a K1300s as one of my bikes.

 

So here is what I would say. If you can post it I would be grateful.

 

We are bikers. We are designers. We were concerned that people would get off the bike and go get coffee and leave the heat-troller remote turned on and waste the battery. So we, in our wisdom, set the time out for 1.5 min for it to shut down if it received no contact from the receiver. Seemed to make sense. Until it did not. We are testing longer delays so if the 1.5 min turn off is an issue, contact me off forum and we can do something.

 

I just wish you would have contacted me directly with your complaint. Maybe we would have changed this sooner if we knew people were upset by the short time out. but since we now make a receiver that can plug to the bike for power, we can offer a longer timeout.

mike at warmnsafe.com

[moshe_levy]

I dealt with Mike on my winter test. Nice guy, and very responsive to customer feedback.

 

-MKL

[JohnM]

Mostly on Moshe's MCN review & recommendation, I bought an EXO controller to replace no-longer-functional Gerbings unit. Mounted it up by the clutch lever. Really like it (other than the LED display turned 90 degrees.)

[Rob L]

So, the EXO will work with my Gerbing liner. Will it be able to handle the gloves with the same controller, or do I have to buy 2?

[JohnM]

Rob:

 

I'm using a Gerbings non-microwire jacket liner. Connector wires on the EXO are the same type as those on my old Gerbings controller.

 

The EXO model I have only has 1 output wire, so you'd have to use gloves in series w/ the jacket, not independently.

[moshe_levy]

Rob, ALL of this stuff works together. They all have coax connectors, except Aerostich which uses SAE for some reason. You can mix and match gloves, liners, pants, socks, controllers, whatever. It works on a standardized plug system. That's assuming you see a need to do that. I do it because I believe Gerbing's makes the best gloves, W&S makes the best liner, and EXO makes the best controller. No one brand has a lock on everything (at least that I tested).

 

EXO's controller has one input plug, so if you want to control your gloves separately, buy another EXO for it. I am coming off of an old Gerbing's dual controller and in all honesty - and this is personal preference only - I'm fine with just the single EXO. The RT has more than enough room for two mounted up on the handlebar mounts if the need arises.

 

-MKL

[RockBottom]

I dealt with Mike on my winter test. Nice guy, and very responsive to customer feedback.

 

-MKL

 

Same here. I had a tech question and he quickly put me in touch with the guy who designed the device.

[tallman]

We have the Gerbings leather cover for our controllers.

They slip over the adjuster belt/strap of our jackets.

Easy to reach, no cutting/pasting/velcroing of the bike.

Easeepeasee.

[EddyQ]

Ed, I'd contact W&S on that cycling issue. I don't believe it's supposed to do that. Per my lit received with my test sample, quoting from my article based on the info I got from W&S and tested personally:

 

"The controller and receiver are very easy to synch together to allow communication. The process involves turning the controller on and off quickly 3 times, and then plugging the receiver to power within 10 seconds. Once synched, you never have to do it again. "

 

Moshe, it is not a sync issue. I think it is basically how the thing works. It only syncs when powered up from the off state. As George said, it isn't much of a bother because you should have turned it off when you walk away from your bike. I used it for a while and never knew til someone on ADV posted the comment. SO, I tested and sure enough, this is how it works. But, if the power wire comes out while riding, you're gonna need to do this twist of the knobs trick. I think it is all about saving battery life. . . .

[markgoodrich]

Ed, I'd contact W&S on that cycling issue. I don't believe it's supposed to do that. Per my lit received with my test sample, quoting from my article based on the info I got from W&S and tested personally:

 

"The controller and receiver are very easy to synch together to allow communication. The process involves turning the controller on and off quickly 3 times, and then plugging the receiver to power within 10 seconds. Once synched, you never have to do it again. "

 

Eddy, you're exactly right...see my previous post with a quote from the W&S owner. My permanent-mount version doesn't have the "issue" since it has no battery.

 

Moshe, it is not a sync issue. I think it is basically how the thing works. It only syncs when powered up from the off state. As George said, it isn't much of a bother because you should have turned it off when you walk away from your bike. I used it for a while and never knew til someone on ADV posted the comment. SO, I tested and sure enough, this is how it works. But, if the power wire comes out while riding, you're gonna need to do this twist of the knobs trick. I think it is all about saving battery life. . . .

[CoarsegoldKid]

Mike at W&S I hope you are listening here. Funny I don't recall seeing this explanation in W&S lit. What I'm not pleased with is the 1/3 heating when plugged into the bike with the remote turned off.

Sometimes all we want is liner/windbreaker and no electric heat. Reaching down to unplug is easy. Reaching down to re-plug isn't. I have a hard enough time seeing the connector just sitting on the bike using two hands. An on/off switch inline with the liner power would be welcomed.

[EddyQ]

What I'm not pleased with is the 1/3 heating when plugged into the bike with the remote turned off.

 

Joe, you can get no power with it plugged in. But you have to first sync them by turning on, then off. The 1/3 power is a resonable failsafe IMO.