The Irony - I think I killed my Enersys Battery

[moshe_levy]

Look, I agree Enersys' technical documents are often full of irregularities. Sometimes contradictory data points, and there is some salesmanship there. (The website is extremely poor and hard to navigate).

 

But I don't spend my time with powersports batteries - I do spend my time with batteries that survive the harshest environments the US Military is involved in. And when their products come back after a decade of pure abuse in Iraq or Afghanistan, it's good enough for me, and it's certainly head and shoulders above everything else. That's the bottom line - go to a military show where lead acid batteries are used, and tell me what other brand you find. Don't hold your breath.

 

Are there bad cells? Yes. Is this charging issue, shall we say, finicky? Yes. It is. It just cost me the trip I've been waiting 7 years to take!! But my experience with this cell isn't the be all end all, and is actually cancelled out by many other positive experiences.

 

I will add that few, if any, companies we deal with have such competent tech help by phone. If only they got those guys to WRITE some of that stuff down and redo the spec sheets, it would certainly improve things.

 

The story of my escape from WV was just literally sent to Vince Winkel at BMW Owner's News a few minutes ago. I'm light on pictures since my phone was near dead the entire "interesting" part of the story, but I tried to describe what happened. I hope he publishes it, and I hope you enjoy it.

 

-MKL

[roger 04 rt]

Please be very careful trying to de-sulfate an AGM or Gel cell battery. There is no way to check and/or replace the water or electrolyte. Both options in section 16 start with checking the electrolyte which is not possible on an AGM.

 

While AGM batteries have excellent recovery attributes and most weak AGM batteries can be restored to near full capacity, by definition it is hard to argue with those saying an AGM cannot be de-sulfated.

 

I may be wrong but I believe Roger is discharging his battery in a controlled way and charging it in a normal manner, he is not de-sulfating it, if that is even a word.

 

Terry

 

Terry, I don't know if my battery has sulfation or if it can be removed. I am discharging at 2 amps, slower than the 5 hour rate for the pc680. The 5 hour rate is 3 amps. Here are quotes from the Odyssey provided procedure I am using:

 

"The ODYSSEY battery manual reconditioning procedure described below can be performed up to 5 times to maximize the results. The procedure requires slowly discharging the battery and correctly charging the battery to recover the battery’s capacity by de-sulfation. For best results with this procedure, it is highly recommended that an ODYSSEY programmed approved charger be used that meets the recommended charging criteria for the product."

 

And,

 

"Basic reconditioning (de-sulfation) cycle:

1) Is the voltage at least 12.2V (50% State of charge). If greater than 12.2V OCV, go to step 3 otherwise, go to step 2.

2) Charge the battery as described above. (Example: PC1500 (62Ah @ 10 hour rate) x 40% = 25 Amps with an acceptable charger)

3) Discharge the battery down to 10.0V as described above. Time the discharge from a full state of charge (at least 12.6V OCV) down to 10.0V. Go to step 2.

This procedure needs to be performed at least two times to confirm that the battery has become sulfated and to be effective. Confirmation of sulfation and recovered capacity is indicated by longer run times with each successive timed discharge at the same rate of discharge. If it takes longer to discharge the battery than the previous discharge cycle then repeat steps 2 and 3. Otherwise the procedure has been maxed out and nothing will be gained by further cycling."

 

RB

[terryofperry]

Hey Roger

 

I do not disagree, I was pointing out the need to be careful regarding the process. Some chargers have an "equalize/desulfate" mode on them, Odyssey is pointing out not to use this mode on AGM batteries.

 

"The recommended charging current for an ODYSSEY battery is 40% of the 10 hour amp hour rating of the battery for cyclic applications (about 6A for a single 16Ah rated PC680), a constant float voltage of 13.5-13.8V and no constant voltages exceeding 15.0V in any kind of automatic de-sulfation/reconditioning/equalize mode. At greater than 15.0V the battery can overcharge, overheat, and/or go into thermal runaway. Maintaining the battery at less than 13.5V will bring the battery down and maintain it in an undercharged condition causing sulfation and premature failure."

 

Terry

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[roger 04 rt]

Terry, We're on the same page. Your comment made me wonder if a battery can be de-sulfated or if the recondition process is doing something else. After two cycles I do have more battery capacity. RB

[roger 04 rt]

After cycling the battery the 5th time and leaving it in the Odyssey charger's pulsed-float mode for a couple days, which injects 750 mA for about 5 seconds and then let's the battery relax, I went out this morning and cold started. Finally, it turned over for about a second, started and ran smoothly.

 

I'm planning to run some additional voltage sensitivity tests and need a programmable power supply which can double as a charger (at about twice the price) so I need to sell the Odyssey and have put it in the Classifieds for a good price.

 

I'm hoping that by modifying the alternator with a diode that I can bring the battery above 90%. It's a shame I partly spoiled the battery with the wrong charger and low alternator voltage. Live and learn.

 

RB

[Guest Kakugo]

Roger, if this can help you, I noticed ever since changing over to a PC680 my bike check routine appear to be considerably faster than it was with previous batteries.

 

On the issue of chargers: due to work commitments I couldn't ride the RT for a full week, so I decided to plug in the new CTEK battery charger I bought following Enersys's recommendations.

I put it in AGM mode, as recommended: this function has a "Soft Start" (12,6V/7A), then going into "Bulk Charging Mode" (14,7V/7A) once the charger's microprocessor is satisfied the battery is not too badly sulphatated. Once the battery reaches 80% charge amperage is progressively decreased until 100% charge is reached. Finally there's the customary "Analyze" phase to check if the battery will hold charge.

 

From the moment I plugged the charger in until I got the green light it took a little under a hour (I was working on the other bike in the garage so I kept an eye on the charger). A Yuasa battery with a TecMate charger took at least twice as long in similar conditions. Highly impressed with both charger and battery.

 

[roger 04 rt]

Many thanks, I saw the CTEK charger it looks quite good. I've decided to buy a manual, adjustable DC power supply which will let me make more voltage sensitivity tests and serve as a manual charger. As a result I have put my nearly-new Odyssey charger in the Classifieds for a good price. It brought my battery from 67% to 100% with six cycles of the battery. RB

[terryofperry]

Kakugo

 

Which model CTEK do you have?

 

Thanks

 

Terry

[jbr7t]

Alright, Ya'll are much smarter than me so I might be asking a dumb question. I've been using a Battery Tender Plus on my bike 12V - 1.25amp. I don't have an Odyssey battery. It's just a standard battery. Should I be concerened that I'm damaging the battery?

[dirtrider]

Alright, Ya'll are much smarter than me so I might be asking a dumb question. I've been using a Battery Tender Plus on my bike 12V - 1.25amp. I don't have an Odyssey battery. It's just a standard battery. Should I be concerened that I'm damaging the battery?

 

Morning James

 

Probably not but without knowing the battery that you have in the bike no way to know for sure.

 

My suggestion to you is to write down the battery name, type, any other battery info you can find then Call Deltran (877-456-7901) & ask their opinion.

 

[jbr7t]

Thanks Dirtrider